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IS TRUMP A FASCIST?
IS DONALD TRUMP A "FASCIST"?
YES [ 3 ] ** [42.86%]
NO [ 4 ] ** [57.14%]
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Todd Simpson
post Jun 18 2016, 08:36 PM
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On the NOT trump angle, we have the mouthpiece for the former KGB (RT America) saying trump is a fascist. hmmm Pot calling the kettle black perhaps, but some interesting bits none the less smile.gif



On the FOR TRUMP angle, we have Faux, sorry, Fox news with Bill Oreilly. You decide smile.gif



This post has been edited by Todd Simpson: Jun 18 2016, 08:37 PM


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Mertay
post Jun 18 2016, 11:36 PM
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Some expert should seriously compare the guy to Turkey's erdoğan, dealing with this (born from democracy) dictator for many years I see lots of resemblances from his tv character and his arguments.


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fkalich
post Jun 19 2016, 12:40 AM
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QUOTE (Mertay @ Jun 18 2016, 05:36 PM) *
Some expert should seriously compare the guy to Turkey's erdoğan, dealing with this (born from democracy) dictator for many years I see lots of resemblances from his tv character and his arguments.


I have confidence in our Constitutional protections. Keep in mind what motivated the creation of the American Constitution, fear by the wealthy class, slave owners, land speculators, and holders of debt, that their wealth were being threatened by political movements on State levels. They built in checks and balances that prevented radicalization, and that includes precluding the President from overstepping prescribed bounds. It really does not take the Senate much to impeach a president, if they want to do that. And you always have the Supreme Court, 9 justices with life-long terms (30 years on average) who have the final say on an issue, and keep anyone from getting too far out of line. And the American Constitution if VERY difficult to change, that is it's strength.

My concerns about the guy stems from Trumps ignorance. Did you now that the guy does not even read books? Even George W Bush was a serious reader. We now have someone who actually makes George W. Bush look good in comparison, who would have thought it?

But I don't think he will win. It is frightening, he could do a lot of damage in the short time congress and the Senate would tolerate him, but still I think he will be beaten fairly soundly. Actually I wanted to see him as the nominee because I felt that he was the one Republican pretty sure to lose. Still, I am left with the fact that a great deal of Americans support someone like him, and what that says about people in America.

I vote "no", I think he is not really a facist, I think that is an act to draw appeal from his targeted segment of American voters. There was no other way for him to become the Republican nominee. But I do believe he is very ignorant about how the world works from a global political perspective, and that may be even more dangerous.

This post has been edited by fkalich: Jun 19 2016, 01:15 AM
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Spock
post Jun 19 2016, 02:35 AM
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Even more alarming than liberals calling Trump a fascist (as well as a racist) are the violent, belligerent mobs of anti-free speech communist quacks that feel the need to harass and attack peaceful Trump rally attendees.

The real fascists and racists are the thugs that represent Hillary and Bernie.

And holy shit can I post a ton of videos to prove that.

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Todd Simpson
post Jun 19 2016, 02:52 AM
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Good point! I hadnt thought of that comparison smile.gif I do keep seeing people comparing Trump to Hitler in the media in terms of the Toxic Election in Germany in the late 1920s. Of course, Trump supporters, take it to mean that people are saying trump = Hitler, which is not really the argument being put forth.

QUOTE (Mertay @ Jun 18 2016, 06:36 PM) *
Some expert should seriously compare the guy to Turkey's erdoğan, dealing with this (born from democracy) dictator for many years I see lots of resemblances from his tv character and his arguments.


Nobody had called anybody anything until your post here it seems sad.gif It's just a "poll" asking a question smile.gif Or at least, it was, until you posted "The real fascists and racists are the thugs that represent Hillary and Bernie". sad.gif So we have three in just one sentence sad.gif Including "Thug". Can't we discuss and ask questions without leveling accusations of "Thuggery?"

Sadly, I've seen violence on both sides of Trumps rally's sad.gif From black people being punched by Trumpers to anti trumpers attacking trumpers. No matter which side it's on, it's sickening IMHO and reminiscent of the violent clashes between communists and Hitler supporters in the late 1920s. The fact that we can't just talk and disagree, as a people, without resorting to fisticuffs, is truly sad. In honesty though, it's clearly been sad on both sides. sad.gif

QUOTE (Spock @ Jun 18 2016, 09:35 PM) *
Even more alarming than liberals calling Trump a fascist (as well as a racist) are the violent, belligerent mobs of anti-free speech communist quacks that feel the need to harass and attack peaceful Trump rally attendees.

The real fascists and racists are the thugs that represent Hillary and Bernie.

And holy shit can I post a ton of videos to prove that.


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Spock
post Jun 19 2016, 12:16 PM
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Is it not common knowledge that the mobs of anti-Trump supporters continuously and loudly proclaim Trump as a fascist? Then you post the O'Reilly opinion with the spin of "Faux" news - automatically spinning that opinion as illegitimate in your personal opinion.

Sort of a passive aggressive way of saying you support the idea he is a fascist and I would bet you are one of the 3 which voted that he was. That's fine, you are entitled to your opinion.

I do not see him at all as a fascist. Nationalistic, yes, but even that word has been painted as hate speech by the left. And the insinuation would have to be that if Trump is a fascist, then people that support Trump are either gullible sheep, or fascists themselves.

So we have name calling from the get-go. Fascist.

To which I reply, " violent, belligerent mobs of anti-free speech communist quacks"

There is a difference I will give you that - Trump being a fascist is merely speculation which people would open for debate. However what is not debatable is the fact that there are consistently mobs of violent, belligerent, anti-free speech communist quacks that mob up for Trump rallies to harass supporters. How many times have you seen this from Trump supporters at Hillary or Bernie rallies?

And, how many times have you seen a black person being punched by Trump supporters? I guarantee it was that one single video.

Should we start a post war on instances of side versus side concerning this? I mean, if we're going to discuss Trump being a fascist, let's also discuss anti-Trump protestors acting like Hitler's Brownshirts.

Or should I start another thread comparing the two so that this thread can stay focused on if Trump is a fascist. Which isn't name calling of course, because it was presented as a question.

Maybe I should start a thread, "Is Hillary's Girlfriend a Saudi Spy"? Or, Are the Anti-Trump protestors Thugs? They wouldn't be biased of course, as they would merely be presented as questions for one to consider.

So - here is a brief interview with one of us fascist Trump supporters which has been left bleeding after Trump rally.

Notice all the peaceful, loving, non-thuggish anti-Trump protestors in the video...

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jstcrsn
post Jun 19 2016, 12:39 PM
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Should this thread also talk about if Hillary is a liar or is this another thread




Come on Todd , if Msnbc calls her a liar



QUOTE (Mertay @ Jun 18 2016, 11:36 PM) *
Some expert should seriously compare the guy to Turkey's erdoğan, dealing with this (born from democracy) dictator for many years I see lots of resemblances from his tv character and his arguments.

I first would like to ask you what stories you have that lead to believe he is like the person you mentioned as in a forum like this sources and proof are required , I don't think you would tell your students how to do something with just hearsay.
2 . maybe experts don't want to get in that debate because they have seen evidence on both sides
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Spock
post Jun 19 2016, 12:52 PM
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For the sanctity of this particular thread I will concede that my 2 posts derailed it.

Please continue with the debate of whether or not Trump is a Fascist.

I have seen the light and I now realize how to conduct political debates on a guitar forum.

See, an old dog can learn new tricks. smile.gif
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jstcrsn
post Jun 19 2016, 01:24 PM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jun 18 2016, 08:36 PM) *
On the NOT trump angle, we have the mouthpiece for the former KGB (RT America) saying trump is a fascist. hmmm Pot calling the kettle black perhaps, but some interesting bits none the less smile.gif

On to your first video , I did not want to re run and waste Kris's space on just a propaganda video = sad music , misleading statements , Pictures taken a the right time to make him look "evil" ,undocumented hearsay from a "non-biased " panel ( what flavor is that cool-aid ) . The first statement that he wants to documents American muslims was false - He wants to document new arrivals as their is very little truth we can know about them ( seems like a good idea to me, I mean I have to be documented and am on a database for owning several guns ), but when a video starts with a misrepresentation , you can bet what the rest will be
His response starts at 1:55


QUOTE (Spock @ Jun 19 2016, 12:52 PM) *
For the sanctity of this particular thread I will concede that my 2 posts derailed it.

Please continue with the debate of whether or not Trump is a Fascist.

I have seen the light and I now realize how to conduct political debates on a guitar forum.

See, an old dog can learn new tricks. smile.gif

I can't count the times since I have been hear that a chillout thread has varied from its title
( to be fare , I am a unedjumacated sheep , and I probably can't count that high )

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Spock
post Jun 19 2016, 02:14 PM
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QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Jun 19 2016, 08:24 AM) *
I can't count the times since I have been hear that a chillout thread has varied from its title
( to be fare , I am a unedjumacated sheep , and I probably can't count that high )



LOL. I'm right there with you. I made it through college and still can't sign my name. That's why Common Core is so vitally important - so I can still feel good about myself understanding I'm just a victim of an intolerant society.
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jstcrsn
post Jun 19 2016, 02:56 PM
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QUOTE (Spock @ Jun 19 2016, 02:14 PM) *
LOL. I'm right there with you. I made it through college and still can't sign my name. That's why Common Core is so vitally important - so I can still feel good about myself understanding I'm just a victim of an intolerant society.

hey , your post is starting to shift from the title , I'm on to you

its not about you being right here with me , making it thru college , signing your name , Common core , feeling good about yourself , understanding you're a victim or an intolerant society . Just answer the dang question and shut it

And I felt as if we should just keep it on as few as threads as possible so as not clutter the forum with gobbly gook

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Spock
post Jun 19 2016, 03:08 PM
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I understand! I must be a fascist, but my fascism should be celebrated and welcomed. Otherwise would be racist.
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Kristofer Dahl
post Jun 19 2016, 04:48 PM
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QUOTE (Spock @ Jun 19 2016, 03:35 AM) *
And holy shit can I post a ton of videos to prove that.


Ok - this might explain why this discussion starts to feel a bit unbalanced.

A video does not proove anything. If I wanted to, I could probably find videos claiming the earth is flat and that earthworms are the most lethal animals in the world.

This is also why I have not bothered watching many of your videos.

If you want to convince me about the legitimicy of your standpoint (whatever the topic is), then you should provide your own analysis - based on at least somewhat established facts.

But since I know you use biased videos as your sources, your arguments and analyses won't be worth much to me. As mentioned by others, they just take up a lot of space in otherwise very interesting threads.


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Spock
post Jun 19 2016, 06:47 PM
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My analysis has nothing to do with speculation such as whether or not the earth is flat. They are not videos of people trying to prove a point.

They would be videos such as the one above of someone that got the hell beat out of them simply for being a Trump supporter leaving a rally, as well as rioting - they are real and raw - not speculation on any sort of theory. These would be based on "established facts" - I wouldn't waste my time otherwise.

The videos prove a point I am making. If I simply write my analysis then someone would claim it is not fact - so I would just as soon post irrefutable facts you can see for yourself.

If you don't care to watch them that's fine. You can choose not to take my word for anything either which I suspect is the case, but when I say I can post videos to prove, I can. And nobody can post videos to prove the earth is flat.

I would imagine you did watch the videos Todd posted though.


Here's another video which is more compelling than any flat earth video. My analysis of it - Trump rally protesters are brutal thugs and because they are intolerant hypocrites they gang up on innocent people.

Don't watch it though - don't dare see the truth



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jstcrsn
post Jun 19 2016, 07:39 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Jun 19 2016, 04:48 PM) *
Ok - this might explain why this discussion starts to feel a bit unbalanced.

A video does not proove anything. If I wanted to, I could probably find videos claiming the earth is flat and that earthworms are the most lethal animals in the world.

This is also why I have not bothered watching many of your videos.

If you want to convince me about the legitimicy of your standpoint (whatever the topic is), then you should provide your own analysis - based on at least somewhat established facts.

But since I know you use biased videos as your sources, your arguments and analyses won't be worth much to me. As mentioned by others, they just take up a lot of space in otherwise very interesting threads.

sorry to point out the fact this might be the most fascist point posted yet , This is how your post came across to me

Your wrong , You are biased so in my haughtiness I don't need to give your post a look or response .

One of the most Passively aggressive Fascist statements IMO , now If you wanted to deny my posting rights based on my response , you could complete your fascism and shut opposite view points down
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Todd Simpson
post Jun 19 2016, 08:32 PM
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Easy there smile.gif I don't think we can really say just yet who is or isn't fascist per se as neither candidate has actually been in power yet. I was more curious who "thought" Donald Trump was a fascist.
It's just a poll. Here is the websters definition of FASCISM:

Full Definition of fascism
1.)Often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
2.)A tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control <early instances of army fascism and brutality — J. W. Aldridge>
fascist play \-shist also -sist\ noun or adjective often capitalized
fascistic play \fa-ˈshis-tik also -ˈsis-\ adjective often capitalized
fascistically play \-ti-k(ə-)lē\ adverb often capitalized

-----

But to give time for time, let's also ask about Hillary smile.gif I"ll post the same poll for Hillary, Trump may win here in our small sample with his strong support on this site smile.gif

P.S. As I mentioned in my previous post, there are wads of videos on yotube featuring both sides of presidential campaign behaving in a shameful way. UPDATE: I even went ahead and posted some of them from the other side to illustrate they are plentiful, and still shameful.

[b]Here is the link to the IS HILLARY A FASCIST poll.
I'll refrain from voting so as not to schew the results.

https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_fo...showtopic=57118


QUOTE (Spock @ Jun 19 2016, 07:16 AM) *
Is it not common knowledge that the mobs of anti-Trump supporters continuously and loudly proclaim Trump as a fascist? Then y
Notice all the peaceful, loving, non-thuggish anti-Trump protestors in the video...


To be sure both candidates are indeed "LIARS" Here is a quick bit of info for ya on that. From politifact.com (a non partisan site)

Here are two charts. Showing the relative truthfulness of our current candidates. To be clear, I'm NOT Pro Hillary, I"m Pro Democracy smile.gif

*Adding a link to where the graphic came from helps "source" the information. So it's always a good idea wink.gif

http://www.politifact.com/personalities/hillary-clinton/
Attached Image
http://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/
Attached Image

To be sure, both candidates are "Liars". It does seem though that one candidate has a harder time being truthful though. sad.gif



QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Jun 19 2016, 07:39 AM) *
Should this thread also talk about if Hillary is a liar or is this another thread
...

Come on Todd , if Msnbc calls her a liar

I first would like to ask you what stories you have that lead to believe he is like the person you mentioned as in a forum like this sources and proof are required , I don't think you would tell your students how to do something with just hearsay.
2 . maybe experts don't want to get in that debate because they have seen evidence on both sides


Very true smile.gif You can find videos of BIGFOOT flying UFO"s if you like smile.gif Hard to call youtube videos "Primary Sources" and or "Proof" of anything, on either side of any debate.

Here is a video showing OBAMA'S SECRET SERVICE GUY IS A LIZARD!!!!!


AND THE EARTH IS FLAT!!!
smile.gif: heheheheheh


*THE VIDS I DIDN"T WANT TO POST, but here we go sad.gif

-SHAMEFUL behavior on both sides of the supporters/Anti it seems. So just for reference then, here are some vids of TRUMP SUPPORTERS behaving badly. (Again, both sides can be blamed here and it's sad. The sheer quantity of these types of vids on both sides is what makes them such bad sources for "proving" anything IMHO. They just take up space)





There is no end to these. They are mostly just mud slinging and make for poor supportive arguments IMHO sad.gif


QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Jun 19 2016, 11:48 AM) *
Ok - this might explain why this discussion starts to feel a bit unbalanced.

A video does not proove anything. If I wanted to, I could probably find videos claiming the earth is flat and that earthworms are the most lethal animals in the world.

This is also why I have not bothered watching many of your videos.

If you want to convince me about the legitimicy of your standpoint (whatever the topic is), then you should provide your own analysis - based on at least somewhat established facts.

But since I know you use biased videos as your sources, your arguments and analyses won't be worth much to me. As mentioned by others, they just take up a lot of space in otherwise very interesting threads.


This post has been edited by Todd Simpson: Jun 19 2016, 09:33 PM


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AK Rich
post Jun 19 2016, 09:08 PM
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About Politifact:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/...e/#1bf7b16d316a

http://www.weeklystandard.com/section/politifact

http://cmpa.gmu.edu/political-studies/


QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jun 19 2016, 11:32 AM) *
c=57118[/url]

To be sure both candidates are indeed "LIARS" Here is a quick bit of info for ya on that. From politifact.com (a non partisan site)

Here are two charts. Showing the relative truthfulness of our current candidates. To be clear, I'm NOT Pro Hillary, I"m Pro Democracy smile.gif

Attached Image
Attached Image

To be sure, both candidates are "Liars". It does seem though that one candidate has a harder time being truthful though. sad.gif





Very true smile.gif You can find videos of BIGFOOT flying UFO"s if you like smile.gif Hard to call youtube videos "Primary Sources" and or "Proof" of anything, on either side of any debate.


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Todd Simpson
post Jun 19 2016, 09:41 PM
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Sadly, the links you provided to discredit politifact are all right wing/conservative/heavily biased/etc.. sad.gif Just as an example.

*link first for refernce smile.gif
(I"m sure the weekly standard or something like it will say that SOURCEWATCH is corrupt as well smile.gif
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/Cente..._Public_Affairs
History of the CMP
The Center for Media and Public Affairs was founded in the mid 1980s by S. Robert Lichter and Linda Lichter.[2] According to Salon.com, "the seed money for [the] center was solicited by the likes of Pat Buchanan and Pat Robertson".[3]

The Weekly Sandard and Forbes speak for themselves and ardently conservative and right wing organizations. So to have these folks saying Politifact isn't objective is just not very solid. sad.gif The site I"m using here, to comment on yours, (sourcewatch) is part of the CENTER FOR MEDIA AND DEMOCRACY: a bit of history on them.

http://www.prwatch.org/cmd/index.html
CMD is led by Lisa Graves, who formerly served as Deputy Assistant Attorney General at the U.S. Department of Justice and Chief Counsel for Nominations for the chair of the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee, among other strategic research and analysis roles in Washington, DC. These exposés reveal how some of the most powerful corporations in the world manipulate public policy, elections, and some in the media in ways that undermine real democracy.


As for POLITIFACT, here is a bit of actual history on them as an organization.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/bl...for-politifact/

Updated Monday April 18, 2016, at 1:30 p.m.


As we've gained new readers over the years, every now and then we get emails that ask, "Who's paying for this website? Who's putting out this information?"

The short answer: PolitiFact is a project of the Tampa Bay Times and its partner news organizations to help you find the truth in American politics. (See more about our mission on the "About Us" page.) The Times is the biggest newspaper in Florida, so the advertisers and subscribers help foot the bills for PolitiFact.

Yeah, yeah, you say. But who owns the Times ?

The answer to that question is a little long, but interesting.

Back in the 1970s, the Times was owned by Nelson Poynter, whose father Paul Poynter had bought the paper in 1912. (It was then called the St. Petersburg Times; the name changed to the Tampa Bay Times in 2012.)

Nelson Poynter had a passion for journalism, especially for independent journalism. As he thought about the future of his newspaper, he knew that he wanted to keep it independent and vigorous, even after his own death. So he created a plan to leave his newspaper, not to his family, but to a nonprofit school for journalism he created for the purpose.

"I haven't met my great-grandchildren. I might not like them," Poynter said.

Poynter died in 1978, and his plan went into place. The school -- now called the Poynter Institute -- owns the newspaper. The Poynter Institute offers seminars and classes to working journalists, educators and students, and its website, Poynter.org, is a clearinghouse for information and news about journalism.

Control of the newspaper and its operations, however, lies with a single executive. Upon retirement, that leader picks a successor. Poynter himself picked Eugene Patterson, who picked Andy Barnes, who picked the Times ' current chairman and CEO, Paul Tash.

We know of no other news organization in the country that runs like this.

Since 2010, the Times has partnered with other news organizations to operate PolitiFact sites in the states. Some of these partners are newspapers, such as the Atlanta Journal-Constitution and the Austin American-Statesman (both part of Cox Media Group); and the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel (part of Gannett Co. Inc.). We also partner with Scripps television stations based in Arizona, Colorado, Nevada and Ohio; with Capital Public Radio based in Sacramento, Calif., and with Billy Penn, a Philadelphia-based mobile-first news website.

From time to time, we’ve accepted financial support for our independent fact-checking from foundations that seek to improve news coverage or civic discourse.

We received a grant from the Democracy Fund that has assisted us in expanding to new states. The Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation has supported the PolitiFact Global News Service, which fact-checks claims about health and global development. The John S. and James L. Knight Foundation has supported our efforts to fact-check political content on the publishing platform Medium.

For our PunditFact project -- which fact-checks talking heads and opinion leaders -- we have received grants from the Ford Foundation and the Democracy Fund. Seed money for the project was provided by craigconnects.

In previous years, we’ve accepted underwriting for our PolitiFact Florida project from the Knight Foundation, Craigslist Charitable Fund, and the Collins Center for Public Policy.

But when it comes to the question of "Who is PolitiFact?" or "Who pays for PolitiFact?", we can assure you that no one is behind the scenes telling us what to write for someone else's benefit. We are an independent, nonpartisan news organization. We are not beholden to any government, political party or corporate interest. We are proud to be able to say that we are independent journalists. And for that, we thank Nelson Poynter.



----
In short, sourcewatch is widely regarded as a "watchdog" organization that isn't afraid to point out who is being paid to say what. They have very solid leadership role keeping people honest IMHO. The gal that started it, is a bit of a crusader as you can read per her short bio.

Politifact, by no means a perfect organization, is also widely regarded as an objective watchdog group and has taken down both democrats and republicans. They don't stop short calling either side out for not telling the truth. Sourcewatch and Politifact both have solid reputations for journalistic integrity. Between them and PEW RESEARCH, we have 3 sources that consistently focus on objective facts and are not created solely to push a given "agenda". I'd take anything from any of these three as a good place to start. They do get things wrong, everybody does at some point. But they are all valid sources that often criticize the LEFT and the RIGHT so I'd suggest we call them "Primary" in terms of polling/research/etc.



QUOTE (AK Rich @ Jun 19 2016, 04:08 PM) *


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AK Rich
post Jun 19 2016, 09:49 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Jun 19 2016, 07:48 AM) *
Ok - this might explain why this discussion starts to feel a bit unbalanced.

A video does not proove anything. If I wanted to, I could probably find videos claiming the earth is flat and that earthworms are the most lethal animals in the world.

This is also why I have not bothered watching many of your videos.

If you want to convince me about the legitimicy of your standpoint (whatever the topic is), then you should provide your own analysis - based on at least somewhat established facts.

But since I know you use biased videos as your sources, your arguments and analyses won't be worth much to me. As mentioned by others, they just take up a lot of space in otherwise very interesting threads.


Recent news related to the videos Spock has posted regarding anti Trump folks at Trump rallies. Satisfied?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverythi...-broke-my-nose/

http://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/lgb...d-trump-n594691

QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jun 19 2016, 12:41 PM) *
Sadly, the links you provided to discredit politifact are all right wing/conservative/heavily biased/etc.. sad.gif Just as an example.

*link first for refernce smile.gif
(I"m sure the weekly standard or something like it will say that SOURCEWATCH is corrupt as well smile.gif
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/Cente..._Public_Affairs
History of the CMP
The Center for Media and Public Affairs was founded in the mid 1980s by S. Robert Lichter and Linda Lichter.[2] According to Salon.com, "the seed money for [the] center was solicited by the likes of Pat Buchanan and Pat Robertson".[3]

The Weekly Sandard and Forbes speak for themselves and ardently conservative and right wing organizations. So to have these folks saying Politifact isn't objective is just not very solid. sad.gif


Yeah I know, everything is biased except for the sources you provide. My bad.
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Todd Simpson
post Jun 20 2016, 02:00 AM
Post #20


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Not everything smile.gif You just picked three in particular sad.gif However, as I Mentioned in another thread in response to Spocks post, I"m going to join him in taking a break from all of this political back and forth and try to get back to making more posts that are guitar related. However, if anyone wants to have a private conversation on a political issue, please do shoot me a PM smile.gif

Todd


QUOTE (AK Rich @ Jun 19 2016, 04:49 PM) *
Yeah I know, everything is biased except for the sources you provide. My bad.



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