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> Poll: Should Political Topics Be Disallowed At Gmc?
Political discussion
Should political topic discussions be disallowed in the GMC forum?
Yes [ 10 ] ** [50.00%]
No [ 10 ] ** [50.00%]
Total Votes: 20
  
AK Rich
post Oct 29 2016, 05:32 PM
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A simple question poll.

Should political topic discussions be disallowed in the GMC forum?

Edit: That first yes vote is mine. I just don't think that this is the place to discuss these things and there are plenty of other forums on the web that are designed specifically for political discussions.
Discussing politics does nothing to help anyone excel at playing guitar so why do we need those types of discussions here?

This post has been edited by AK Rich: Oct 29 2016, 06:09 PM
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klasaine
post Oct 29 2016, 05:42 PM
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I'm not 'voting' in this poll but I will say this ...

When they are started with the intention to be provocative and inflammatory, then yes.

*Love ya crsn but man you like to stir the shit.

This post has been edited by klasaine: Oct 29 2016, 05:46 PM


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AK Rich
post Oct 29 2016, 05:49 PM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Oct 29 2016, 08:42 AM) *
I'm not 'voting' in this poll but I will say this ...

When they are started with the intention to be provocative and inflammatory, then yes.

*Love ya crsn but man you like to stir the shit.


Thanks for weighing in, Ken. Good point, man.
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Mertay
post Oct 29 2016, 06:31 PM
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Until the election topics we didn't have any problems that I remember of...

The first days I joined here made a topic on Gezi protests in Turkey, the support was very nice. Also 3-4 months ago about the coup just to note I was still alive biggrin.gif

Many things can happen around the world and its nice to get opinions from unbiased friends, thats why I'm ok with political topics.


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Todd Simpson
post Oct 29 2016, 07:06 PM
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I'm for posting a poll WITH every "Political" post with a simple, is this post appropriate for GMC YES/NO. Simple eh? If it gets some NO votes, the admins can just get rid of it as not appropriate for GMC.


If it's some inflammatory, poorly sourced, clearly biased, youtube video, fringe blog repost, twitter rantish thing, etc. (Trying as hard as I can to avoid naming names here as that would be a "PERSONAL ATTACK" which we try to avoid here @ GMC) then it probably has NO PLACE here @ GMC where we try to encourage an atmosphere of fellowship and NOT something adversarial.

Todd



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Phil66
post Oct 29 2016, 09:19 PM
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Personally I don't think any legal subject should be banned from GMC. Yes there are other forums that are dedicated to any subject but it's good to have healthy debate amongst friends.

The only thing that should be banned is personal attacks, name calling etc.

The right to swing your fists, stops where the other person's nose begins!

QUOTE (AK Rich @ Oct 29 2016, 05:32 PM) *
Discussing politics does nothing to help anyone excel at playing guitar so why do we need those types of discussions here?

Rich, the Chill Out Zone is an off topic board wink.gif

Phil

This post has been edited by Phil66: Oct 29 2016, 09:22 PM


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Kristofer Dahl
post Oct 29 2016, 10:13 PM
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I think civilized discussions about touchy topics does nothing but strengthen our community!

I also think that many tragedies of the past would have been avoided if there had been an open discussion around them.


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Phil66
post Oct 29 2016, 11:06 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Oct 29 2016, 10:13 PM) *
I think civilized discussions about touchy topics does nothing but strengthen our community!

I also think that many tragedies of the past would have been avoided if there had been an open discussion around them.

Yeah, as i said, healthy debate is good, you just have to be pragmatic. I never get involved in politics. I know what I want and why but, I don't need to argue about it.

Phil


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Rammikin
post Oct 30 2016, 12:29 AM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Oct 29 2016, 06:06 PM) *
If it's some inflammatory, poorly sourced, clearly biased, youtube video, fringe blog repost, twitter rantish thing, etc. then it probably has NO PLACE here @ GMC where we try to encourage an atmosphere of fellowship and NOT something adversarial.



Yeah, we can dance around it and pretend the issue is whether political threads should be allowed, but, just like Ken says, what you've described is really the issue here. I'd like to be able to say "hey if you don't like a thread, ignore it". But the fact is this forum is only as good as the posts members put here. The threads that start with a random inflammatory youtube video can, and do, change this forum into an ugly place that is not fun to visit. My heart sinks when I visit GMC and see a thread like that at the top of the recent posts list. I know it has changed my perception of GMC for the worse.










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yoncopin
post Oct 30 2016, 02:10 AM
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QUOTE (Rammikin @ Oct 29 2016, 07:29 PM) *
Yeah, we can dance around it and pretend the issue is whether political threads should be allowed, but, just like Ken says, what you've described is really the issue here. I'd like to be able to say "hey if you don't like a thread, ignore it". But the fact is this forum is only as good as the posts members put here. The threads that start with a random inflammatory youtube video can, and do, change this forum into an ugly place that is not fun to visit. My heart sinks when I visit GMC and see a thread like that at the top of the recent posts list. I know it has changed my perception of GMC for the worse.


This is exactly how I feel about it too, you couldn't have worded it better Rammikin. It mostly just bums me out, I don't visit GMC to read that junk.


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jstcrsn
post Oct 30 2016, 10:06 PM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Oct 29 2016, 05:42 PM) *
*Love ya crsn but man you like to stir the shit.

If you don't stir it , it stinks for all that walk by. If you do stir it, it turns into wonderful fertilized topsoil ready to grow something
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Kristofer Dahl
post Oct 30 2016, 10:19 PM
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QUOTE (Rammikin @ Oct 30 2016, 01:29 AM) *
Yeah, we can dance around it and pretend the issue is whether political threads should be allowed, but, just like Ken says, what you've described is really the issue here. I'd like to be able to say "hey if you don't like a thread, ignore it". But the fact is this forum is only as good as the posts members put here. The threads that start with a random inflammatory youtube video can, and do, change this forum into an ugly place that is not fun to visit. My heart sinks when I visit GMC and see a thread like that at the top of the recent posts list. I know it has changed my perception of GMC for the worse.



QUOTE (yoncopin @ Oct 30 2016, 03:10 AM) *
This is exactly how I feel about it too, you couldn't have worded it better Rammikin. It mostly just bums me out, I don't visit GMC to read that junk.


@ Rammikin & yoncopin

But doesn't it offer you comfort that people you like and trust, get to respond to these posts?

The reason these strange videos appear even in our little corner of the web - is because the opinions are real and exist. As much as I wish it weren't so - I am at least very happy we get to discuss them here in the open.

Again: many historical tragedies could have been avoided if people got to vent their opinions. I feel very proud to have community that can do this and hopefully make a change for the better.


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Rammikin
post Oct 30 2016, 10:46 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Oct 30 2016, 09:19 PM) *
But doesn't it offer you comfort that people you like and trust, get to respond to these posts?


Kris, you're asking us what we think of trolling smile.gif. Trust me, if there is one thing to be learned from the internet, it's this: trolling is a bad thing on a forum smile.gif.


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yoncopin
post Oct 30 2016, 11:10 PM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Oct 30 2016, 05:19 PM) *
But doesn't it offer you comfort that people you like and trust, get to respond to these posts?


Not really, but again I think Rammikin hit it on the head, I kinda wish people just wouldn't feed the trolls. I don't think we're having a very high level debate here. I didn't, and won't be, voting in the poll, and I'm not being dismissive of anyone's opinion or their right to their point of view. I just don't enjoy the toxicity and I don't think it's elevating discussion at GMC. I really try to only be positive when posting online, it is all attributable in the end. Hopefully it will all just go away on it's own in a week when the election is over.


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GeneT95
post Oct 31 2016, 12:16 AM
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I voted 'No'

I don't post much. I don't have time. I don't read those posts. I find them rarely useful even if mildly entertaining if I am in the mood, which I rarely am. But, even if I had time I wouldn't be reading them instead of trying to increase my guitar knowledge.

Although, I did think of and did check if Mertay posted after subacute events in the past. Not that we're friends necessarily or have conversed before. But he is a GMC brother and I've travelled a lot and check where people are from to see if I've ever been there. So I thought of him during recent events.

That being said. I don't think banning a particular subject is useful. Banning a particular person who treats others poorly during a discussion or continually posts banal inflammatory diatribe may be. Discussion is broadening even if it rarely changes entrenched narrowed minds. Community is doomed if we can not discuss esp subjects with intrinsically high emotion.

I don't partake. Nor is it required. If you've a stout heart, a good character, an open mind, and a calmness to understand, then perhaps entertaining such subjects may be broadening. If you become wounded easily and have a myopic gaze then perhaps its best to stick to the guitar related posts.

I leave the policing to the moderators and site admins. I voted not because I think it matters or influences those in control, but because I like clicking buttons and, given my temperament, is the only voting I'll be doing this fall.

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Monica Gheorghev...
post Oct 31 2016, 08:33 AM
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I will not vote because I would like to have the option "give one more chance before political topics to be disallowed".

People should express freely their opinions but I'm not agree when people cross the line and transform a peaceful place in a boxing ring. I like to believe that what's happened in that thread (I really not liked what I saw) was just an isolated case. We all have different points of view but forcing the rest to see things in the same way as we do, it's not a good idea.

I don't know if should be disallowed political topics. Most people can express their opinions in a normal way without personal attacks. I think would be necessary more strictly rules for this kind of situations. An obvious personal attack should be punished immediately in a more drastic way. Also if a topic becomes "dangerous" that thread should be closed before people to cross the line. Some topics are sensible and sometimes even if you don't have in mind to offend someone, it's possible to slip some words which are not ok. It's important to be careful how you use these words because sometimes depend of the context where you put them wink.gif
Of course if a new political topic will bring the same hostile atmosphere, I would really like these topics to be disallowed from GMC ( even without asking the students their opinion about it).

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bleez
post Oct 31 2016, 09:40 AM
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Although I tend not to touch political threads with a bargepole, I voted 'no'. I would not like to see any topic get outright disallowed here. I understand people can get wound up about certain things and feel strongly about subjects but thats fine in my book smile.gif As long as it stays respectful.


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Marek Rojewski
post Oct 31 2016, 12:00 PM
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I have "extreme" political views rooted in my extensive political and historical research. I can't stand political correctness and censorship. Because of this I try to avoid posting anything politics-related to avoid unnecessary "flame war" "bad feelings" etc... I think that banning those discussion would be even more harmful than allowing them.

Having said that I also don't like the current situation when moderators can intervene in Chill out forum in these discussions. I would rather have a "hyde park" part of the forum where everything is allowed. What was most annoying in the current Hilary/Trump discussion for me, was the whole "what is a personal attack and what isn't" discussion. If I am talking with a supporter of X and say "ya know most of X supporters are uneducated, poor, narrowminded people" it is obvious that the person will be offended even if in theory it is not a personal attack. Really I couldn't believe mature people discuss such things from that perspective...

Anyway sorry for my rant, I didn't vote any option, as I don't think the problem is discussing politics...


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jstcrsn
post Nov 1 2016, 04:10 AM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Oct 29 2016, 07:06 PM) *
I'm for posting a poll WITH every "Political" post with a simple, is this post appropriate for GMC YES/NO. Simple eh? If it gets some NO votes, the admins can just get rid of it as not appropriate for GMC.



Todd

so now we get to start controlling what can and can't be said , I just don't know how to respond to that statement . On the one hand it sound nice and fuzzy that we shouldn't have anything inflammatory , on the other , it sounds a lot like thought police (i.e, thats how dictators start )

There is no way to have a contrary statement that isn't inflammatory to someone .You just somehow think what you say is always correct , but remember the issues are pretty much evenly divided so no matter what your stance , you will have a vast amount of opposition

In general I have always been lumped in with the uneducated inflammatory group and it does not hurt my feelings at all.
But lets look at reality . I was told I was an ideologue for thinking or being afraid of a terrorist attack in the us and low and behold( in the middle of our discussion) we have a night club attack which kills many people .
I then have an" inflammatory" post asking when is enough evidence enough, the thread gets shut down while I was out of town but as I get back in town I learn The FBI reopens its case with Hillary . HUH

and this is why I think these topics should be allowed , when you see differing opinions then yours proven right or wrong , we all need to be willing to look at our selves and honestly say "maybe I had it wrong" . But when all we get is what we want to hear
How will we ever grow!
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fkalich
post Nov 1 2016, 06:41 AM
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QUOTE (Marek Rojewski @ Oct 31 2016, 06:00 AM) *
If I am talking with a supporter of X and say "ya know most of X supporters are uneducated, poor, narrowminded people" it is obvious that the person will be offended even if in theory it is not a personal attack. Really I couldn't believe mature people discuss such things from that perspective...


Why is it immature to state facts? Are we supposed to ignore the implications of this? And I think myself and others made it clear that we were talking about averages, medians, bell curves, not about individuals with the statistics. And averages, medians, bell curves are what matters, not individual data points. Hell I'm old, and I don't feel offended by the second chart.

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