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> Keeping Motivated To Perfect A Rec, How do you do it?
Wyverex
post Nov 8 2016, 05:01 PM
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Hey,

I had very mixed feelings about my last REC: https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/guitar_fo...showtopic=57616

On the one hand, I was very happy to have finally nailed the timing (at least I think I have...), which for me was the most important thing this time. On the other hand, a lot of other stuff is falling short. Somehow I expected a much better rating considering I worked on that lesson for several weeks now. I don't want to complain because I think I got exactly what I deserved smile.gif , it's just that I was pretty convinced that I had visibly improved only to find out that (just one example) somehow my pick moved to the back of my index finger (as correctly pointed out by Ben) over the last weeks without me even noticing. dry.gif
Darius also hit home when saying that I could have detected most issues by myself. And to be honest, when I set my mind to make a REC last Sunday and wasn't happy with any of the takes (and there were a lot), I knew deep inside that I wasn't ready yet but I just wanted to get it over with anyway.

At this point I'm pretty much torn apart between just letting that lesson be (I'm really starting to get sick of it) and finally having a lesson really nailed. What's better here? "Finished, not perfect?" or "As good as I can possibly make it?". I believe that perfecting a lesson would push me forward a great deal but I just don't know how to find the motivation to do it. I think I have a natural tendency to move to the next best thing when I'm getting annoyed by something. I'm not lacking motivation to play guitar, I'd play all day long if I could, but somehow that doesn't translate to playing the same thing over weeks and weeks just to make it perfect.

This is not about motivation in general but that very specific motivation to push through until the end.

So how do you guys do it? Some of you get high ratings consistently. Does it come kind of easily to you to work on a lesson until it's perfect? Do you concentrate on a single lesson or do you work on other stuff in parallel?

As a sidenote: Why is it forbidden for the poster to reply to a REC thread? This would make asking questions easier because otherwise you have to write several PMs or create new threads.
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Mirba
post Nov 8 2016, 05:19 PM
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Considering i'm pretty new to the site I can't talk about REC's, because I haven't done that many. But when I really want to learn a specific solo/riff/song, i'm not going to be happy until I play it consistently without any major errors. And In my opinion it's totally worth all the frustration when you finally nail it.
That moment when you nail it, is the reason for me personally, why playing guitar is so enjoyable.
Maybe let the lesson rest for a week and pick it back it later. Eventually you are going to nail that lesson!


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bleez
post Nov 8 2016, 06:10 PM
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Based on my own experience...... Its easy to be so keen on submitting a rec take that you overlook parts of your playing which might not be as good as it could be.
I find it helpful to record a rec take then wait until the next day before posting, if I still think its okay then I'll post it. There's been a bunch of times where Ive decided at that point to keep working on it.

Im quite happy to take a break from a lesson and come back to it later and fresher. You cant always improve technique to a deadline that you 'think' you should be hitting and other stuff you play will be transferable. I have a few lessons Ive been working on for a LONG time, way longer than I thought I would be cool.gif

I work on a lot of lessons, probably a few too many but I like the variety more than anything.

That being said.... its not like Im getting perfect recs or anything rolleyes.gif so what do I know!


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MisterM
post Nov 8 2016, 07:02 PM
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Hi

It is a normal feeling. The section REC is a good thing but it can sometimes be a surprise.
We are amateur players and the coachs are professionals ....

We play 1 or 2 h per day with for only objective: play better.
The coaches play 4/5 a hour per day for years, they certainly integrated an music school, their learning was
more natural than our.

At the beginning, it's difficult for us to see and to hear our mistakes.
Their criticisms are sometimes surprising, but they are necessary to make progress us.

You are right, timing is very important, but it is the easiest phase.
1/5 of the time need to timing and 4/5 of the time need for cleanliness and precision.
1 week for the timing and 4 weeks for the rest - It is long but it is on this part that we get progress.

On your lesson, you did a good work and you should not be disappointed.
You can keep working it - it is necessary to play some sequences with the metronome to gain flexibility
Try to improve your tone with light delay.

When you will have a little more experience, you will more be a quick learner and all this will be more natural.
It is necessary to be patient and give the best of yourself on every sequence.


My work :

I learn several lessons.
Some are more difficult than the others.
I make videos which I show has my coch "Gab" in mentor section.
He helps me, he tells me which sequence I have to work.

Before post my video on-line, I look at the original.
I try to respect all things and when I see a small error, I try to correct it, I begin again


Keep working, learn other styles : blues, funk - you will be better from day after day, be confident

Excuse my english, I try to do a simple word and I use reverso.

This post has been edited by MisterM: Nov 8 2016, 07:33 PM


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yoncopin
post Nov 8 2016, 07:33 PM
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I've had very similar feelings in the past. I was so excited to share a REC take, then a bit disappointed in the outcome, despite knowing the instructors were right. I try now to share more frequent smaller updates with Gabriel in my mentor thread. Maybe once a week, just one section of the lesson or the parts you've learned thus far. You get more guidance along the way and it isn't such an all or nothing feeling. It's really hard to get a good take in one shot, unless you really know a lesson, and that does seem to take longer than you'd expect. Just keep working on it, and I try to have a few smaller goals to keep up the variety.

This post has been edited by yoncopin: Nov 8 2016, 07:34 PM


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Phil66
post Nov 8 2016, 08:37 PM
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It can be disheartening posting to REC but I think it is very important. I'm not the kind of person to chase perfection, except in my job where I work to microns.

I have just received my first ever "three 9s" in REC and was over the moon, there are small errors but I have moved onto another lesson with my mentor Gab. Personally, I like to move on to fresh material as soon as I have my current material convincing enough that it is easily recognisable with no blatant mistakes. There have been other REC takes where I have only just about got a pass with two instructor scores being the same but on 2 points lower and then I have wanted a consistent result so I have re-posted takes until all instructors agree.

HERE is my latest REC, for me that is enough to be able to move on. So long as it is a pass and I myself am happy with it I move on otherwise I feel like I'm chasing rainbows. The last 5% can take longer than the first 95%.

What I do when I get a new lesson, I polish the old one as a warm up routine.

This works for me and keeps me fresh.

You really have to find out first and foremost what makes YOU happy and keeps you wanting to carry on.

Hope this helps wink.gif


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jstcrsn
post Nov 8 2016, 08:58 PM
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you have to be able play everything , in your head , without your guitar in your hands . Your hands usually do what your brain tells them, at this point , its mostly mental . So your practice is programming your brain - thats why repetition is important
I have also found that when I " fell in love " with playing a piece slower than than the lesson ( even though I could play it as fast ) is when my attitude changed for the better and guitar was fun rather than trying to get it up to speed
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Monica Gheorghev...
post Nov 8 2016, 09:15 PM
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From my point of view, when you make a lesson very close to the original take made by instructor, you will get 100% profit from it. In this way the progress will be much fast and very visible.

I focus at a single lesson. Because I'm totally addicted to receive high grades in REC, I work with my instructor at every tiny detail from each lesson. I'm very demanding with me. I not post in REC until my instructor not say that my take it sounds great.
For each lesson I work between one month and many months without getting bored. I can play the same bar every day for a lot of hours until I'm able to play each detail correctly. Before to send my weekly homework to Darek, I look at my video and I try to find how many mistakes I can and I write these in the message. The fact that I can detect some of the mistakes from my playing and in the same time I can see a constant progress in each take, it helps me a lot.


From my point of view, I think it's normal to be forbidden for the student to reply in a REC thread. That section it's just for exams (treat the REC section like a college where you give regular examinations wink.gif ). Keeping "clean" (without reply) that section, our instructors can have a maximum focus over our playing ( and this is for our good).
I truly believe if one student will start to reply in a REC thread, all the students will make in the same way. Probably at some point will be impossible for our instructors to give us a very detailed and objective feedback because in the same time they will have to respond at too many questions.
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Marek Rojewski
post Nov 8 2016, 10:09 PM
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There are good sides of "rushed" REC posts - you get feedback the moment you post your take, and in this situation it is faster wink.gif Faster feedback - faster opportunity to use it.

I also wouldn't force myself too much, if I can get 8,5 grades on REC and yearn to learn something else than the lesson I've been practising for weeks/months already, I don't see a reason why not to wink.gif


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Wyverex
post Nov 8 2016, 10:17 PM
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Thank you all for your detailed answers. Much appreciated smile.gif It's encouraging to see that we're all kind of in the same boat.

I guess my primary problem is still that I'm impatient. I've cut away so much stuff that was way too difficult for me and I'm concentrating on the basics now and feel good with that! But I still try to force speed too early, I think. I usually start very slowly and it feels great to be able to play groovy and without mistakes but sooner or later I increase speed and things start falling apart. I guess I don't allow my brain and muscle memory to adapt in their own speed because I want to get "there" faster.

Also I probably have too much stuff going on. Gabe's mentoring, Todd's shred journey, Shtedfest, a company gig at our annual Christmas party and recently I've started to jam with a drummer. It's all cool but way too much. I want it all and I want it now rolleyes.gif

Ok first order of business: Cut away more. Secondly: stay at slow tempo until I can play it in my sleep. I guess that's a start.

And I think I have to read Effortless Mastery again smile.gif
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Darius Wave
post Nov 8 2016, 11:13 PM
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I would only like to add few words as response to your primary post.

We all keep developing our playing. Each of us at his own tempo. You need to realize that learning to play does not only improve our manual skills but also our perception of precision in playing. You will buy me a beer when you''ll look at your rec takes after few years and you'll see how much more you can not only play but hear as well smile.gif Then you'll be able to answer yourself to the question you've just asked smile.gif

We've all been there. You don't want to know how many recordings I have I would be ashamed to publish from the days I though I was already quite good smile.gif It's natural.

Keep in mind we - "rec guardians" have a really hard task to do. It's a constant struggling between trying to reward students for a work they did, with a higher grade, at the same time being honest with them about the point they are at the moment( in playing education). We try to give objective judgment but at the same time we're just humans right ?smile.gif

This post has been edited by Darius Wave: Nov 8 2016, 11:15 PM


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Wyverex
post Nov 8 2016, 11:27 PM
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QUOTE (Darius Wave @ Nov 8 2016, 11:13 PM) *
You will buy me a beer when you''ll look at your rec takes after few years and you'll see how much more you can not only play but hear as well smile.gif Then you'll be able to answer yourself to the question you've just asked smile.gif


I think you've earned that beer already by what you are doing all the time: Giving honest and impressively helpful critique to us mere mortals smile.gif Thank you for that!

QUOTE
Keep in mind we - "rec guardians" have a really hard task to do. It's a constant struggling between trying to reward students for a work they did, with a higher grade, at the same time being honest with them about the point they are at the moment( in playing education). We try to give objective judgment but at the same time we're just humans right ?smile.gif


I think you all rated me just fine, I hope it didn't come across as complaining, because it wasn't meant that way. It's just my own impatience I have to deal with. But that's part of the journey, too smile.gif
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Todd Simpson
post Nov 8 2016, 11:57 PM
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The good thing about REC takes is that you can always do it over if you don't make the grade which provides another chance for more practice smile.gif But if you pass a given rec, I'd say take the win and move to a new rec smile.gif There are plenty of them. You can even take one on that is similar to one you just passed if you think you need more work on a given thing. Congrats on getting the pass!!! Every victory is worth celebrating when you are learning an instrument IMHO. Keep challenging yourself by doing the recs. If you don't think you really deserved the pass, I'd say take it and pick a similar rec and work on the same thing again smile.gif As they say, every win is a win. smile.gif


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Darius Wave
post Nov 9 2016, 10:38 AM
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No worries...no hard feelings here smile.gif It's good to share any kind of thoughts/doubts. This way way can make things clear and live peacefully smile.gif


The truth is you can decide however your learning process would look like. If you feel like your one of those that get borred fast and need to skip to something else to keep motivation, then you can simply abandon lessons at some point. Usually any kind of feedback you'll get, will be usefull for anything else you'll start after lesson you've posted in rec. You just need be preapared for the risk that your take my not pass, but you know...world keeps going. Someday you can get back to it and repost your new take smile.gif

You can of course post many takes over one lesson but I belive it has no deeper sense if the distance between takes is short. Very often we can spot takes that have some improvements but for example, not enough to skip to next grade level. Then the students can get a wrong image of him being not developing his skills. Patience and focus while practise...that's what's necessary smile.gif


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Phil66
post Nov 9 2016, 12:11 PM
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+1 on what Darius dais.

The is another thing that can happen, you can spend so much time developing a technique that was not up to level that when you post another take the instructors comment about something not being good enough but it was before. I had that when I posted a REC take four times. I didn't get a better result because each time a different thing was holding the points back. You lets things slip sometimes when you're aiming for a better score and you concentrate so much on the bad points that what were the good points deteriorate a little.

Just more food for though mate, keep up with your good work, you're doing just great smile.gif


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