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Todd Simpson
post Jan 29 2017, 03:56 AM
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FKALICH. Well said and might I add, Bravely Said.

You nailed it. That's exactly what is going on, despite the fact that there are some folks that simply won't be able to see that or accept it. It doesn't change that it is what it is, and that it came from the top and we all bear the shame and stain of it.

To create a "Religious Test" by Presidential Decree is nothing less than a reason to Impeach the man. It goes against the very fabric of our nation. To say otherwise is to admit limited understanding of the bill of rights and the constitution itself.

The best part is that SAUDI ARABIA (where most of the 911 hijackers came from) WASN"T EVEN ON THE LIST OF PLACES THAT WERE BEING BANNED FROM ALLOWING MUSLIMS INTO THE UNITED STATES!!!!


The fact that the commander in chief could write a decree like this, and mean it, says it all. We finally have proof that has no idea what he is doing, and that he is apt to making entirely unconstitutional decisions at the drop of a hat.

I"m ashamed of being from this country today. I hope I don't have to be ashamed tomorrow.


Todd
QUOTE (fkalich @ Jan 28 2017, 09:18 PM) *
The anti-immigrant move is right up there with going after Jews as a national threat to Germany in the 1930's. If anything is just made the world more dangerous for us. But safety was not the intent, the intent was to focus the attention of his supporters on a red herring, right out of the fascist play book.


Yeah, but we have a bigger problem. There are some that dispute this, but from my observation of him, I concur with with the diagnosis below.

Below is from U.S. News...

John D. Gartner, a practicing psychotherapist who taught psychiatric residents at Johns Hopkins University Medical School, minces as few words as the president in his professional assessment of Trump.

"Donald Trump is dangerously mentally ill and temperamentally incapable of being president," says Gartner, author of "In Search of Bill Clinton: A Psychological Biography." Trump, Gartner says, has "malignant narcissism," which is different from narcissistic personality disorder and which is incurable.

Gartner acknowledges that he has not personally examined Trump, but says it's obvious from Trump's behavior that he meets the diagnostic criteria for the disorder, which include anti-social behavior, sadism, aggressiveness, paranoia and grandiosity. Trump's personality disorder (which includes hypomania) is also displayed through a lack of impulse control and empathy, and "a feeling that people ... don't recognize their greatness.

"We've seen enough public behavior by Donald Trump now that we can make this diagnosis indisputably," says Gartner. His comments run afoul of the so-called Goldwater Rule, the informal term for part of the ethics code of the American Psychiatric Association saying it is wrong to provide a professional opinion of a public figure without examining that person and gaining consent to discuss the evaluation. But Gartner says the Trump case warrants breaking that ethical code.


This post has been edited by Todd Simpson: Jan 29 2017, 04:03 AM


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jstcrsn
post Jan 30 2017, 02:30 PM
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just as a quick reference , most of these problems in the middle east are a direct result of Clinton and Obama policies Failures , Where was your outrage then ?
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Spock
post Jan 30 2017, 04:58 PM
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Would also like to add that Islam is not simply a religion - it's also a political ideology, one with it's own set of laws which they adhere to above the secular laws of our nation.

If someone wishes to to immigrate to our country, they can do it legally and abide by our laws.

I would agree that if I were POTUS I would add Saudi Arabia to the list as well as other Muslim nations.

Trump has done a better job than i could have imagined in such a short period of time. I finally have hope for our country after the last 30 years and especially the last 8 years of pussification.

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AK Rich
post Jan 30 2017, 05:33 PM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jan 28 2017, 06:56 PM) *
FKALICH. Well said and might I add, Bravely Said.

You nailed it. That's exactly what is going on, despite the fact that there are some folks that simply won't be able to see that or accept it. It doesn't change that it is what it is, and that it came from the top and we all bear the shame and stain of it.

To create a "Religious Test" by Presidential Decree is nothing less than a reason to Impeach the man. It goes against the very fabric of our nation. To say otherwise is to admit limited understanding of the bill of rights and the constitution itself.

The best part is that SAUDI ARABIA (where most of the 911 hijackers came from) WASN"T EVEN ON THE LIST OF PLACES THAT WERE BEING BANNED FROM ALLOWING MUSLIMS INTO THE UNITED STATES!!!!


The fact that the commander in chief could write a decree like this, and mean it, says it all. We finally have proof that has no idea what he is doing, and that he is apt to making entirely unconstitutional decisions at the drop of a hat.

I"m ashamed of being from this country today. I hope I don't have to be ashamed tomorrow.


Todd


Have you actually read the EO? Your claim of a "Religious Test" is complete fiction. The word "Muslim" is not anywhere to be found in the order and "Religion" is only mentioned as it refers to Religious Minorities facing Religious Persecution in those countries. The order is based on security reviews conducted by the Obama admin. There are multiple precedents to support the EO. It is a security measure and nothing more.
There is far too much drama in the news and this thread, and many of the posts here, and reports in the news seem to be based on emotions rather than logic IMO. Having concerns about it is fine but don't you think there is a rush to judgement here to condemn the President as a racist when there really is no basis for it? If it was a ban on all nations with a Muslim majority you might have something, but it isn't and it is only temporary until better vetting processes can be developed and implemented.
Can we all take a deep breath here and look at this logically rather than emotionally?
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klasaine
post Jan 30 2017, 06:26 PM
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QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Jan 30 2017, 06:30 AM) *
just as a quick reference , most of these problems in the middle east are a direct result of Clinton and Obama policies Failures , Where was your outrage then ?


The Reagan administration sowed the initial seeds.
We fought a proxy war with the then 'Soviet Union' in Afghanistan throughout most of 80s. *Rambo III for you Stallone fans
When the Soviets left so did we. We and the Soviets didn't even give them the normal aid package for hospitals and schools. We blew the shit out of their country and then we just split. But we had now armed and trained - over 9 years - what then became the Mujaheddin/Taliban which also eventually provided a base for Bin Laden's activities.

This is a pretty straightforward account ... https://history.state.gov/milestones/1977-1...ion-afghanistan

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fkalich
post Jan 30 2017, 07:58 PM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jan 28 2017, 09:56 PM) *
To create a "Religious Test" by Presidential Decree is nothing less than a reason to Impeach the man. It goes against the very fabric of our nation. To say otherwise is to admit limited understanding of the bill of rights and the constitution itself. To understand them you have to do something similar to what you have to do to understand history. To understand history you need to be able to empty your mind of everything we have learned since the time of the historical events.


Todd


Bannon is calling a lot of the shots. The Muslim ban was a bone to throw to his followers, most of whom welcomed it. Bannon and Trump lay out strategies to channel the anger, frustration, hostility of a portion of our population towards those who oppose him and those who are most vulnerable and can't defend themselves. Have you ever read "Inside the Third Reich" by Adolf Speer? It is a good read, to understand how the mindset of the current American administration. Bannon is what Martin Bormann was to Hitler. Trump and his propaganda apparatus work in the same fashion. Bannon has a laid out plan, he is really more dangerous that Trump is, Trump would just screw everything up, Bannon is more and more directing him like a trained monkey. Bannon is as evil as Satan, but he is also as skilled as Satan, the trick is to control Trump without Trump even knowing he is being controlled. i.e. the convenient idiot paradigm.

The next card will be the Supreme Court nominee. They are going to nominate the most extreme Conservative they can come up with, someone that the Democrats cannot possibly allow to be confirmed. They don't care about the nominee. they want a Senate fight, they want to try and persuade the Republicans to end the 180 year filibuster rule that requires 60 votes to get a judge confirmed. If they can get the Republicans to gut the filibuster, they will have succeeded in taking down two more major checks and balances, pillars of our democracy, the filibuster, and following that with the ability to appoint judges that will rubber stamp everything they do. We are in grave danger, I don't think most people are fully aware what of what a perilous situation we are in today. They may succeed. We are on the road to having a President with Putin like control, and one that will be able to maintain control by systematic disenfranchisement of opposition voters, with courts approving the imposed voter restrictions.

This post has been edited by fkalich: Jan 30 2017, 11:58 PM
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jstcrsn
post Jan 31 2017, 12:07 AM
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QUOTE (klasaine @ Jan 30 2017, 06:26 PM) *
The Reagan administration sowed the initial seeds.
We fought a proxy war with the then 'Soviet Union' in Afghanistan throughout most of 80s. *Rambo III for you Stallone fans
When the Soviets left so did we. We and the Soviets didn't even give them the normal aid package for hospitals and schools. We blew the shit out of their country and then we just split. But we had now armed and trained - over 9 years - what then became the Mujaheddin/Taliban which also eventually provided a base for Bin Laden's activities.

This is a pretty straightforward account ... https://history.state.gov/milestones/1977-1...ion-afghanistan

I agree , But Clinton\ Obama really screwed the pouch as far the logistical nightmares of the Refugees , for not only our country , but Europe as a whole

QUOTE (fkalich @ Jan 30 2017, 07:58 PM) *
Bannon is calling a lot of the shots. The Muslim ban was a bone to throw to his followers, most of whom welcomed it. Bannon and Trump lay out strategies to channel the anger, frustration, hostility of a portion of our population towards those who oppose him and those who are most vulnerable and can't defend themselves. Have you ever read "Inside the Third Reich" by Adolf Speer? It is a good read, to understand how the mindset of the current American administration. Bannon is what Martin Bormann was to Hitler. Trump and his propaganda apparatus work in the same fashion. Bannon has a laid out plan, he is really more dangerous that Trump is, Trump would just screw everything up, Bannon is more and more directing him like a trained monkey. Bannon is as evil as Satan, but he is also as skilled as Satan, the trick is to control Trump without Trump even knowing he is being controlled. i.e. the convenient idiot paradigm.

The next card will be the Supreme Court nominee. They are going to nominate the most extreme Conservative they can come up with, someone that the Democrats cannot possibly allow to be confirmed. They don't care about the nominee. they want a Senate fight, they want to try and persuade the Republicans to end the 180 year filibuster rule that requires 60 votes to get a judge confirmed. If they can get the Republicans to gut the filibuster, they will have succeeded in taking down two more major checks and balances, pillars of our democracy, the filibuster, and following that with the ability to appoint judges that will rubber stamp everything they do. We are in grave danger, I don't think most people are fully aware what of what a perilous situation we are in today. They may succeed. We are on the road to having a President with Putin like control, and one that will be able to maintain control by systematic disenfranchisement of opposition voters, with courts approving the imposed voter restrictions.

You could be right , You might be wrong , are you level headed enough to judge correctly ( Give it some time )
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klasaine
post Jan 31 2017, 12:13 AM
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I would put George W. into that mix too.

Our policy in the Middle East has been a disaster for a long time and even as a Jew, I have say that it's really the Israel/Palestinian conflict - and the fact no other Arab countries will take on any burden or responsibility - that has done the most harm. Until that gets worked out there's really not much that any other country can do to ease the tension. Although we certainly can inflame it.

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Todd Simpson
post Jan 31 2017, 02:51 AM
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The "Ban" is simply unconstitutional. No matter how you slice it. So much so, that folks at DOJ are refusing to enforce it. I heard trump say something about a measure like this being able to stop 911. Hmm. Most of those folks were from Saudi Arabia, and they are not on the BANNED country list. Also, no country with a TRUMP hotel made the banned list. How handy smile.gif

Best part, this is only impacting folks with papers. Folks who have gone about things the right way. Including folks like Translators from Iraq who risked their lives to help our troops. It's just flat out wrong and ineffective, but it does play to "The Base" and Trump is a master manipulator to be sure. It also served as a smoke screen while he put Bannon at the head of the National Security counsel. A man with NO political experience, who runs an "Alt Right" blog.

I honestly see the rise of the "Alt Left" as a sociological response to all of this. It's just a matter of time IMHO. sad.gif
-----
For reference (just in case anyone isn't sure, here is the legal angle on why the "Ban" and favoring Christians even slightly, is unconstitutional and beyond any branch of govts power, complete with case law. I was pre-law as an undergrad, but went to film school instead of Law School, thank goodness)


The Establishment Clause forbids the government from making any law “respecting an establishment of religion.” As the Supreme Court explained in 1982’s Larson v. Valente, “the clearest command of the Establishment Clause is that one religious denomination cannot be officially preferred over another.” This constitutional requirement, the court noted, is “inextricably connected with the continuing vitality of the Free Exercise Clause,” guaranteeing religious liberty for all by barring “favoritism among sects.” The court has also declared that the government may not “aid or oppose any religion. This prohibition is absolute.”


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AK Rich
post Jan 31 2017, 04:07 AM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jan 30 2017, 05:51 PM) *
The "Ban" is simply unconstitutional. No matter how you slice it. So much so, that folks at DOJ are refusing to enforce it. I heard trump say something about a measure like this being able to stop 911. Hmm. Most of those folks were from Saudi Arabia, and they are not on the BANNED country list. Also, no country with a TRUMP hotel made the banned list. How handy smile.gif

Best part, this is only impacting folks with papers. Folks who have gone about things the right way. Including folks like Translators from Iraq who risked their lives to help our troops. It's just flat out wrong and ineffective, but it does play to "The Base" and Trump is a master manipulator to be sure. It also served as a smoke screen while he put Bannon at the head of the National Security counsel. A man with NO political experience, who runs an "Alt Right" blog.

I honestly see the rise of the "Alt Left" as a sociological response to all of this. It's just a matter of time IMHO. sad.gif
-----
For reference (just in case anyone isn't sure, here is the legal angle on why the "Ban" and favoring Christians even slightly, is unconstitutional and beyond any branch of govts power, complete with case law. I was pre-law as an undergrad, but went to film school instead of Law School, thank goodness)


The Establishment Clause forbids the government from making any law “respecting an establishment of religion.” As the Supreme Court explained in 1982’s Larson v. Valente, “the clearest command of the Establishment Clause is that one religious denomination cannot be officially preferred over another.” This constitutional requirement, the court noted, is “inextricably connected with the continuing vitality of the Free Exercise Clause,” guaranteeing religious liberty for all by barring “favoritism among sects.” The court has also declared that the government may not “aid or oppose any religion. This prohibition is absolute.”


The EO (Not a law)( does not favor any one religious group. It favors ANY persecuted minority religious group which can be, and in fact ARE religious groups OTHER than Christian AS WELL AS Christian. if they are a persecuted minority religious group in one of the given countries.

And then there is this: https://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/SLB/HTM...0-0-0-2364.html

(f) Whenever the President finds that the entry of any aliens or of any class of aliens into the United States would be detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by proclamation, and for such period as he shall deem necessary, suspend the entry of all aliens or any class of aliens as immigrants or non immigrants, or impose on the entry of aliens any restrictions he may deem to be appropriate.

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/immi...perfectly-legal

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/4443...s-critics-wrong

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/201...-legal-n2278378

PS: Acting Attorney General Sally Yates decision to not enforce Trumps EO was a political decision, NOT a legal decision, which is why she was fired for dereliction of duty.

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fkalich
post Jan 31 2017, 08:10 AM
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QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Jan 30 2017, 06:07 PM) *
You could be right , You might be wrong , are you level headed enough to judge correctly ( Give it some time )


That actually was half way respectful. I will assume it was. I've always been the forgiving sort.

I was watching CNN at my sister's tonight. A most of the analysts were saying how all is in chaos for Trump. But a couple of them, David Gergen for example, have caught on to what is really happening here. Another guy kept saying "President Bannon". At first I thought it was a slip, but after about 5 or 6 times, well nobody slips that much.

Bannon looks on the past week as a well run week, it all fits into his strategy, he and Trump will maintain this kind of atmosphere, one with tension, as confrontational as possible. This is in their playbook.

In American History there has never been a time when a President had both the opportunity and will to threaten the democracy. You like most probably just assume that our democracy as we have known it will always be sustained.

Just look at what is in front of you. More than 50% of school children in public schools are now non-white/Hispanic. The extreme right wing, and most of the super wealthy see the writing on the wall, what is coming if true democracy continues as we have known it. A population demanding a much more equitable distribution of wealth and income. If they succeed in projecting both internal and external enemies with sufficient skill to maintain a sufficient populist base, we may not see another Presidential election that is more than a sham.

Mass disenfranchisement await us according to their scheme. You know all those Hispanics born here to illegal parents? Bannon considers them not to be citizens, he has said so on his website. They have a lot of bones in reserve waiting to be thrown to his populist base to keep them cheering. This is coming, as sure as rain it is coming. This all hinges of where Congress, especially the Senate will stand up to him, and do so before this all goes too far.

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Todd Simpson
post Jan 31 2017, 09:38 PM
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Sadly, the "Checks and Balances" are all out of whack currently, (e.g. all tipping one direction and it ain't toward the left) so counting on the other branches of govt to clamp down on President Banon is not much to hope for.

Again, you are spot on with the demographics. The country is changing, and pretty soon, we will see the change that you are talking about ripple through govt. I mentioned in a previous post that this is sort of the last gasp of "Whiteness" as it were smile.gif As a controlling idea of our "Democratic" System. As the Baby Boom generation continues to age out of the political cycle, (still have a few decades left sadly) I suspect we will continue to see rampant polarization among the voters and the votees. We just have to ride it out and hope there is some semblance of our current system left when it's all said and done. Then again, for some folks, this is the system they wanted so it's a happy time smile.gif Just not a good time to be brown, muslim, foreign, etc.

The limits of the executive branch are going to be tested it seems and we are going to be witness to it. But, then again, it's what I expected when a reality star with no political experience took the highest office in the land. A bit of chaos.



QUOTE (fkalich @ Jan 31 2017, 03:10 AM) *
That actually was half way respectful. I will assume it was. I've always been the forgiving sort.

I was watching CNN at my sister's tonight. A most of the analysts were saying how all is in chaos for Trump. But a couple of them, David Gergen for example, have caught on to what is really happening here. Another guy kept saying "President Bannon". At first I thought it was a slip, but after about 5 or 6 times, well nobody slips that much.

Bannon looks on the past week as a well run week, it all fits into his strategy, he and Trump will maintain this kind of atmosphere, one with tension, as confrontational as possible. This is in their playbook.

In American History there has never been a time when a President had both the opportunity and will to threaten the democracy. You like most probably just assume that our democracy as we have known it will always be sustained.

Just look at what is in front of you. More than 50% of school children in public schools are now non-white/Hispanic. The extreme right wing, and most of the super wealthy see the writing on the wall, what is coming if true democracy continues as we have known it. A population demanding a much more equitable distribution of wealth and income. If they succeed in projecting both internal and external enemies with sufficient skill to maintain a sufficient populist base, we may not see another Presidential election that is more than a sham.

Mass disenfranchisement await us according to their scheme. You know all those Hispanics born here to illegal parents? Bannon considers them not to be citizens, he has said so on his website. They have a lot of bones in reserve waiting to be thrown to his populist base to keep them cheering. This is coming, as sure as rain it is coming. This all hinges of where Congress, especially the Senate will stand up to him, and do so before this all goes too far.



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fkalich
post Feb 1 2017, 12:17 AM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Jan 31 2017, 03:38 PM) *
Sadly, the "Checks and Balances" are all out of whack currently, (e.g. all tipping one direction and it ain't toward the left) so counting on the other branches of govt to clamp down on President Banon is not much to hope for.

Again, you are spot on with the demographics. The country is changing, and pretty soon, we will see the change that you are talking about ripple through govt. I mentioned in a previous post that this is sort of the last gasp of "Whiteness" as it were smile.gif As a controlling idea of our "Democratic" System. As the Baby Boom generation continues to age out of the political cycle, (still have a few decades left sadly) I suspect we will continue to see rampant polarization among the voters and the votees. We just have to ride it out and hope there is some semblance of our current system left when it's all said and done. Then again, for some folks, this is the system they wanted so it's a happy time smile.gif Just not a good time to be brown, muslim, foreign, etc.

The limits of the executive branch are going to be tested it seems and we are going to be witness to it. But, then again, it's what I expected when a reality star with no political experience took the highest office in the land. A bit of chaos.


I hope that your perspective is correct. Maybe I am overly pessimistic, but I have seen America accept things now that just a year or two ago they would never have accepted. This is how a society transforms into an abomination, with much or most of the public not even aware that is happening.

Maybe the WWII example is overused, but the Japanese and German people were not bad people prior to that, no worse than anyone else for sure. But piece by piece, step by step the bought into it, and it lead to their destruction.

Trump, Bannon have a long term strategy, to change our society, our culture, and they will chip away at it. When the latest assault gains public acceptance, and then move on to the next assault.

The disenfranchisement efforts will be significant. They will work to make it hard for much of the Black population to vote. It is already difficult, the average wait time to vote for a Black person is twice that of a White person. And the stringent voter I.D. requirements impact the poor. Blacks have incomes on average 40% lower than Whites.

And they will move to suppress Hispanic voting by denying them citizenship. I mentioned that Bannon's news service has stated that the "Citizenship Clause" of the 14th amendment only applies for children born to people here LEGALLY. If Trump and Bannon are able to stack the courts they may well have a Supreme Court that concurs, and all those new votes you are talking about in the future vanish in a stroke. I know two teen age kids who have been here all their lives, never have even been to Mexico. They would find out that they are no longer citizens, and might even be deported to a country they have never even been in.

The Washington Post has an article today, Trump has a plan to weed out and deport immigrants here who are legally here and on public support.

Sadly, he may succeed, I sense that at first when they do something shocking there is a backlash. But Bannon is a master of psychology/propaganda, he knows what he is doing, and he knows how to knock down a pillar of our Democracy, absorbing the acceptable 5 or 6% drop in the approval rating, and then initiate other distractions to bring that approval rating up within a week or two, and move on to taking down another pillar.

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Todd Simpson
post Feb 1 2017, 03:12 AM
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Sadly, the "Law" is ultimately what the Supreme Court says it is. Until they change it of course smile.gif There are many examples of "Self Inflicted Wounds" from the Judiciary, (Brown V.S. Board of Education Comes to mind). Being able to "Stack the deck" with anti abortion folks, etc. could have serious consequences on existing case law such as ROE V.S. WADE among others.

The only really good news is that the system can self repair, even if it takes decades. The court hands down a "Precedent", then a decision comes along that reinterprets said precedent and the law moves along.

That is the brilliant thing about our system of Governance IMHO, it is made to be flexible, to reflect the will of the people, even as who the "People" are goes through serious changes over time. (E.G. The Demographic shift we keep talking about). So in the end, it will probably end up where your average, working class, Hispanic/Catholic, family wants it to be, as they are the fastest growing/most cohesive voting block. It will start with California and work it's way East, as with all things in the U.S. economic/political that involve change smile.gif "So goes California, so Goes America" as they say.

To draw a historical parallel, (not involving WWII) I really think we are in our akhenaten (Heretic Pharaoh) phase just now. After the king, gives rise to a new king, I think the old temples (laws) will be burned. smile.gif

Todd

QUOTE (fkalich @ Jan 31 2017, 07:17 PM) *
I hope that your perspective is correct. Maybe I am overly pessimistic, but I have seen America accept things now that just a year or two ago they would never have accepted. This is how a society transforms into an abomination, with much or most of the public not even aware that is happening.

Maybe the WWII example is overused, but the Japanese and German people were not bad people prior to that, no worse than anyone else for sure. But piece by piece, step by step the bought into it, and it lead to their destruction.

Trump, Bannon have a long term strategy, to change our society, our culture, and they will chip away at it. When the latest assault gains public acceptance, and then move on to the next assault.

The disenfranchisement efforts will be significant. They will work to make it hard for much of the Black population to vote. It is already difficult, the average wait time to vote for a Black person is twice that of a White person. And the stringent voter I.D. requirements impact the poor. Blacks have incomes on average 40% lower than Whites.

And they will move to suppress Hispanic voting by denying them citizenship. I mentioned that Bannon's news service has stated that the "Citizenship Clause" of the 14th amendment only applies for children born to people here LEGALLY. If Trump and Bannon are able to stack the courts they may well have a Supreme Court that concurs, and all those new votes you are talking about in the future vanish in a stroke. I know two teen age kids who have been here all their lives, never have even been to Mexico. They would find out that they are no longer citizens, and might even be deported to a country they have never even been in.

The Washington Post has an article today, Trump has a plan to weed out and deport immigrants here who are legally here and on public support.

Sadly, he may succeed, I sense that at first when they do something shocking there is a backlash. But Bannon is a master of psychology/propaganda, he knows what he is doing, and he knows how to knock down a pillar of our Democracy, absorbing the acceptable 5 or 6% drop in the approval rating, and then initiate other distractions to bring that approval rating up within a week or two, and move on to taking down another pillar.


This post has been edited by Todd Simpson: Feb 1 2017, 03:15 AM


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klasaine
post Feb 1 2017, 03:33 AM
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One of the great things about history, besides the fact that it repeats itself, is that it can surprise the shit out of you.

*OK, that's two things.



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Todd Simpson
post Feb 1 2017, 10:48 AM
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Two things indeed smile.gif In short, those of us made just a bit sick by goings on in DC needn't twist ourselves in knots. It will all smooth out, eventually. Even if it takes another 20 years to find balance after inevitable backlash/blowback, it will eventually find balance. In the end, "All things find peace, Eventually" ~Mariko Yashida

Todd


QUOTE (klasaine @ Jan 31 2017, 10:33 PM) *
One of the great things about history, besides the fact that it repeats itself, is that it can surprise the shit out of you.

*OK, that's two things.


This post has been edited by Kristofer Dahl: Feb 7 2017, 10:20 PM
Reason for edit: removed image


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AK Rich
post Feb 7 2017, 06:50 PM
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QUOTE (fkalich @ Jan 30 2017, 10:58 AM) *
The next card will be the Supreme Court nominee. They are going to nominate the most extreme Conservative they can come up with, someone that the Democrats cannot possibly allow to be confirmed. They don't care about the nominee. they want a Senate fight, they want to try and persuade the Republicans to end the 180 year filibuster rule that requires 60 votes to get a judge confirmed. If they can get the Republicans to gut the filibuster, they will have succeeded in taking down two more major checks and balances, pillars of our democracy, the filibuster, and following that with the ability to appoint judges that will rubber stamp everything they do. We are in grave danger, I don't think most people are fully aware what of what a perilous situation we are in today. They may succeed. We are on the road to having a President with Putin like control, and one that will be able to maintain control by systematic disenfranchisement of opposition voters, with courts approving the imposed voter restrictions.


What comes around, goes around. IF, it is needed.

"God bless Harry Reid. It’s because of him that Gorsuch is guaranteed elevation to the court. In 2013, as Senate majority leader, Reid blew up the joint. He abolished the filibuster for federal appointments both executive (such as Cabinet) and judicial, for all district and circuit court judgeships (excluding only the Supreme Court). Thus unencumbered, the Democratic-controlled Senate packed the lower courts with Obama nominees."

"Reid was warned that the day would come when Republicans would be in the majority and would exploit the new rules to equal and opposite effect. That day is here."

"The result is striking. Trump’s Cabinet appointments are essentially unstoppable because Republicans need only 51 votes and they have 52. They have no need to reach 60, the number required to overcome a filibuster. Democrats are powerless to stop anyone on their own."

"And equally powerless to stop Gorsuch. But isn’t the filibuster for Supreme Court nominees still standing? Yes, but if the Democrats dare try it, everyone knows that Majority Leader McConnell will do exactly what Reid did and invoke the nuclear option — filibuster abolition — for the Supreme Court, too."

"Reid never fully appreciated the magnitude of his crime against the Senate. As I wrote at the time, the offense was not abolishing the filibuster — you can argue that issue either way — but that he did it by simple majority. In a serious body, a serious rule change requires a serious supermajority. (Amending the U.S. Constitution, for example, requires two-thirds of both houses plus three-quarters of all the states.) Otherwise you have rendered the place lawless. If in any given session you can summon up the day’s majority to change the institution’s fundamental rules, there are no rules."

Did you have concerns then? If not. why should I have concerns now?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/tha...m=.dbda3d5dcf36

This post has been edited by AK Rich: Feb 7 2017, 07:44 PM
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Kristofer Dahl
post Feb 7 2017, 10:19 PM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Feb 1 2017, 10:48 AM) *
Two things indeed smile.gif In short, those of us made just a bit sick by goings on in DC needn't twist ourselves in knots. It will all smooth out, eventually. Even if it takes another 20 years to find balance after inevitable backlash/blowback, it will eventually find balance. In the end, "All things find peace, Eventually" ~Mariko Yashida

Todd


I removed the Trump/Hitler image from this post.

Given the seriousness of the current situation, I think you are better off sticking to discussing the factual matter - which is bad enough without any Hitler images. I don't think they help very much in conveying the legitimacy of your position, though I can certainly agree there are historical similarities.


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jstcrsn
post Feb 8 2017, 01:48 AM
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QUOTE (Kristofer Dahl @ Feb 7 2017, 10:19 PM) *
I removed the Trump/Hitler image from this post.

Given the seriousness of the current situation, I think you are better off sticking to discussing the factual matter - which is bad enough without any Hitler images. I don't think they help very much in conveying the legitimacy of your position, though I can certainly agree there are historical similarities.

I can't believe you would chide Todd for not keeping things factual and then turn right around and do the same thing by saying " there are similarities ", kind of vague and misleading , how are we to dialogue when all you are doing is assassinating character without ant factual matters that we can discuss
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Kristofer Dahl
post Feb 8 2017, 08:33 AM
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QUOTE (jstcrsn @ Feb 8 2017, 01:48 AM) *
I can't believe you would chide Todd for not keeping things factual and then turn right around and do the same thing by saying " there are similarities ", kind of vague and misleading , how are we to dialogue when all you are doing is assassinating character without ant factual matters that we can discuss


I will be happy to discuss smile.gif Given that you reacted on my "I can certainly agree there are historical similarities", I understand you would like to know the similarities between Trump and Hitler, correct?


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