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> Finally! A High Gain Amp With Boost And Gate
Todd Simpson
post Sep 12 2017, 02:52 AM
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I've asked many high end amp builders if they would consider putting a boost section ( basically a tube screamer) in their high gain amps. The reply was always no, it ruins the frequency range, it changes the character of the amp, blah blah blah. That's all fine and good but the fact is that folks are gonna put a clean boost of some kind, very often, in front of their high gain amp to "tighten" up the sound. That happens by, yes, ruining the frequency range (essentially a high pass filter) and changing the character of the amp ( by changing the frequency range, with the tube screamer). Yet this is what folks have to do, in order to get the tight crunch tone they are after. PANAMA are the only builder I know of that put a boost overdrive in the amp itself. However, Misha Mansoor from periphery makes a pedal that is an advanced version of the tube screamer with agate built in. Now he has joined with peavey and stuffed a boost section with a gate, inside the amp! FREAKIN FINALLY! I'm just glad somebody was willing to break the rules and actually do it. These are things folks normally do with pedals. IN the PEAVEY INVECTIVE they are already in the amp.

This is NOT FOR EVERYONE for sure. There are folks who will want to put their own over drive on the floor and tote it around. More power to em. After hearing the amp, I gotta say I'm impressed. I'd be willing to NOT carry around an overdrive and a gate personally, as the ones built in sound just fine to me.

He also built a 2x12 to go with it. Not a 4x12. I used to love my 4x12. After toting it around for years, I fell out of love with it. The idea of a 2x12 makes more practical sense IMHO as you only typically mic one or two speakers max at a gig. He chose two different speakers for the cab to give it more tonal range. He also has used a 2x12 live for years after getting tired of lugging the 4x12.

THE BAD NEWS


Peavey has LOST THEIR FREAKING MIND on the price IMHO. The head is running $1800!!! And the small cab is running $750!!!!! MY GOD!!!! IMHO that is simply insane for a head and 2x12. Granted, it's got great bits in it and it finally has what I've been yearning to see in an amp, and it sounds great!!!!! But $2600 for a head with 2x12? That just seems a pinch insane? sure, we can find similar prices on BOGNER and DIEZEL amps, but this is a freaking PEAVEY! It's supposed to be the working mans amp! Instead it's priced like a boutique amp. This has the same problem as that BOSS JHS pedal. A good idea that is ruined by overpricing. Maybe it's me, whaddya you think??

Here is the demo
Misha doing the demo but using the camera mic so it does sound thinner than the amp does.

Namm demo also looks like camera mic sadly

Bit more detail on this one includes the massive pedal board


Personally, I can get these tones out of my 11 rack, so I won't be spending wads of cash on this amp. However, once it hits the used market, If I were in the market for a tube amp with very flexible tone settings and wads of bits built int, this would be a top contender.

This post has been edited by Todd Simpson: Sep 12 2017, 03:02 AM


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HaveGuitar
post Sep 13 2017, 02:37 PM
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I'll just lean back and wait for someone to profile it for the Kemper... cool.gif

No, but seriously that IS way too expensive! Wonder why... huge development costs? But it's not rocket science, I really have no idea.

Speaking of the Boss/JHS - allmost ordered that today. But then I kinda remembered how bad the reverb is in the Kemper (well, it works and it doesn't suck but its just lacking some brilliance and types) so I ordered a Neunaber Immerse instead.

This post has been edited by HaveGuitar: Sep 13 2017, 02:37 PM


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klasaine
post Sep 13 2017, 08:55 PM
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Yep.
It's like the Boss thing. You can't spend 40 years being essentially the least expensive of the meat and potatoes, decent quality gear and then leap up into boutique prices overnight.

*Resale value will be very low unless they are 1) absolutely phenomenal. 2) A few really known players actually are seen using them and 3) they're discontinued after a relatively short run. Case in point: a used 5150 head can go for as low as $575.00 in good condition. And that's with the famous association.
This goes for the nouvelle boutique Boss pedals too.

Be patient Todd. That new Peavey head will drop significantly in a couple of years.

This post has been edited by klasaine: Sep 14 2017, 01:07 AM


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Mertay
post Sep 13 2017, 10:06 PM
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ENGL amps, if not all many models have a boost switch (I might be wrong but even some models gain works like a pedal is plugged in).

High quality, they are also expensive but resale value (atleast here) is not bad. Must add the expensive heads have a very wide tone range.


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Mertay
post Sep 13 2017, 11:23 PM
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QUOTE (HaveGuitar @ Sep 13 2017, 01:37 PM) *
... so I ordered a Neunaber Immerse instead.


Awesome!


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Todd Simpson
post Sep 14 2017, 12:03 AM
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Smart move smile.gif That's the beauty of the Kemper. It's every amp every made or ever to be made. Which is quite handy! I'm sure there will be some very good invective profiles out there pretty soon. And buying those is much more affordable than the amp, and sometimes the profiles are even free smile.gif Here's to techology! Also, there will probably be a profile with the invective and that new boss/jhs pedal. The "pedal of the moment" seems to get wed to the "amp of the moment" in profiles which is also handy smile.gif

Todd


QUOTE (HaveGuitar @ Sep 13 2017, 09:37 AM) *
I'll just lean back and wait for someone to profile it for the Kemper... cool.gif

No, but seriously that IS way too expensive! Wonder why... huge development costs? But it's not rocket science, I really have no idea.

Speaking of the Boss/JHS - allmost ordered that today. But then I kinda remembered how bad the reverb is in the Kemper (well, it works and it doesn't suck but its just lacking some brilliance and types) so I ordered a Neunaber Immerse instead.


This post has been edited by Todd Simpson: Sep 14 2017, 12:04 AM


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Todd Simpson
post Sep 14 2017, 03:22 AM
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Yeah smile.gif Prices could drop like a stone if it doesn't move well and they cut production after the first year. Also, was mentioned, someone will profile it and make a cool Kemper preset out of it smile.gif I'm with you on being a bit shocked that these companies think they can just BAM charge boutique prices all of the sudden. I don't see it happening.

QUOTE (klasaine @ Sep 13 2017, 03:55 PM) *
Yep.
It's like the Boss thing. You can't spend 40 years being essentially the least expensive of the meat and potatoes, decent quality gear and then leap up into boutique prices overnight.

*Resale value will be very low unless they are 1) absolutely phenomenal. 2) A few really known players actually are seen using them and 3) they're discontinued after a relatively short run. Case in point: a used 5150 head can go for as low as $575.00 in good condition. And that's with the famous association.
This goes for the nouvelle boutique Boss pedals too.

Be patient Todd. That new Peavey head will drop significantly in a couple of years.


It's a pinch different in the engls as it's a switch. In the invective it's actually a full overdrive with full controls before it gets to main distortion stage. You can even apply it to the clean channel for a bluesy tone. Panama is the only builder I've seen do this same thing so far. It makes sense to have a overdrive built in as a clean boost IMHO, it's a somewhat simple circuit that so many folks use who use tube amps, I'm surprised more builders don't just build one in. Mike fortin for example. He builds great heads, then builds great boost pedals for them. Why not just built it right in to the head?

I also like the "mute gate" that the invective has which makes quick palm muting a snap as it doesn't let the noise of the gain through after a quick palm mute. Clever bits to be sure smile.gif Just not $1800 clever.


QUOTE (Mertay @ Sep 13 2017, 05:06 PM) *
ENGL amps, if not all many models have a boost switch (I might be wrong but even some models gain works like a pedal is plugged in).

High quality, they are also expensive but resale value (atleast here) is not bad. Must add the expensive heads have a very wide tone range.


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Mertay
post Sep 14 2017, 11:31 AM
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QUOTE (Todd Simpson @ Sep 14 2017, 02:22 AM) *
It's a pinch different in the engls as it's a switch. In the invective it's actually a full overdrive with full controls before it gets to main distortion stage. You can even apply it to the clean channel for a bluesy tone. Panama is the only builder I've seen do this same thing so far. It makes sense to have a overdrive built in as a clean boost IMHO, it's a somewhat simple circuit that so many folks use who use tube amps, I'm surprised more builders don't just build one in. Mike fortin for example. He builds great heads, then builds great boost pedals for them. Why not just built it right in to the head?


Finding a compatible OD to an amp can be trouble for users, there still is no standad yet to help anybody and I'm sure there won't be any in the near future.

It makes sense to me too but then thought a marshall can sound great with both a ts9 and ds1. Both these od's cleans-up the lows nicely as a boost but does introduce a different character. Then question is which should marshall pick if they intended such thing?

A few brands got over this issue by releasing their own pedals like blackstar, Mesa but the customers simply insist on choosing different pedals smile.gif Best approaches I've seen till now are from ibanez and Boss; Ibanez TSA amps are designed on the ts9 character and boss simply designed a clean amp (katana) to sound best with their gt-100/gt-1 algo distortions.

So basically they did the opposite and built the sound on the pedal. I really like the engineering approach to this and as far as I know both amps (though released at different times and not considered compatitors) are very popular.

This post has been edited by Mertay: Sep 14 2017, 02:16 PM


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Todd Simpson
post Sep 14 2017, 08:15 PM
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It's got some clever bits to be sure smile.gif The OD inside the Invective was matched to it through trial and error. It's evidently a very good match. I like that you can use the OD on the clean channel and get a bluesy breakup type thing and all this can be controlled from a rather large foot pedal with wads of stomp buttons on it. Glad to see clever design finally making it's way in to amps instead of the usual orthodox resistance to such ideas. That was what really impressed me smile.gif

Attached Image

I look forward to hearing the variety of kemper profiles done from this amp as well.

Todd



QUOTE (Mertay @ Sep 14 2017, 06:31 AM) *
Finding a compatible OD to an amp can be trouble for users, there still is no standad yet to help anybody and I'm sure there won't be any in the near future.

It makes sense to me too but then thought a marshall can sound great with both a ts9 and ds1. Both these od's cleans-up the lows nicely as a boost but does introduce a different character. Then question is which should marshall pick if they intended such thing?

A few brands got over this issue by releasing their own pedals like blackstar, Mesa but the customers simply insist on choosing different pedals smile.gif Best approaches I've seen till now are from ibanez and Boss; Ibanez TSA amps are designed on the ts9 character and boss simply designed a clean amp (katana) to sound best with their gt-100/gt-1 algo distortions.

So basically they did the opposite and built the sound on the pedal. I really like the engineering approach to this and as far as I know both amps (though released at different times and not considered compatitors) are very popular.



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