Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Dmaj7add11, building chords
Giacinto
post Oct 17 2007, 02:55 AM
Post #1


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 189
Joined: 11-January 07
From: Germany
Member No.: 1.069



heyho andrew,
i got a little question!!
my teacher wants me to build up a chord like this.
now i wanted to ask you if there are notes which HAVE to be in it...
of courst i need :
D ( ofc. root note laugh.gif )
F (3rd)
A (5th)
Cis (maj7)
G (11 -subdominante)

now is there a rule which determines if i can get rid of some of them or their importance...
i mean can i for example miss the 5th and play the 2th or so?
or have to be all of them included.. i mean i got a chord with more than 6 notes how can i play it? some note has to be less important than another... so can i choose which one i miss.. like the one that i dont like ? biggrin.gif

and also he told me to start building a chord for example starting on the high e string but starting with the 5th up.. hmm im confused right now because how can i see fast which tone has to be the next one in line?
i tried it with intervalls but after some time i got stucked oO
do i have to move down in building order? so i start with the 5th than the 3rd than the root than the add11 and finally the maj7 ??

thanks for any advise!!
cheers rolleyes.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Andrew Cockburn
post Oct 17 2007, 03:58 AM
Post #2


Moderation Policy Director
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 10.459
Joined: 6-February 07
From: CT, USA
Member No.: 1.167



QUOTE ([email protected] @ Oct 16 2007, 09:55 PM) *
heyho andrew,
i got a little question!!
my teacher wants me to build up a chord like this.
now i wanted to ask you if there are notes which HAVE to be in it...
of courst i need :
D ( ofc. root note laugh.gif )
F (3rd)
A (5th)
Cis (maj7)
G (11 -subdominante)


Aha, not so fast! Lets look at that in a little more detail ...

Dmaj7add11 is simply a Dmajor7 and an 11th. If he had said Dmaj11, that would have been slightly different, that would be a regular stacked chord that would have automatically included a 9th.

So, first we make a D major triad:

D is the root
F# is a major 3rd
A is a 5th

You actually had a minor 3rd which would have taken us off in a different direction (Dminormajor7+11).

Next, we need to make it a major 7th, so we would add a C# (you had a C, which is a Dominant 7th).

Now we have a D major 7 (D, F#, A, C#) we would simply add an 11th to it which is a G as you correct;y point out. If we wanted a 9th in there too that would be an E, but see above, we don't need it.

So, we are shooting for D,F#,A,C#,G

QUOTE
now is there a rule which determines if i can get rid of some of them or their importance...
i mean can i for example miss the 5th and play the 2th or so?
or have to be all of them included.. i mean i got a chord with more than 6 notes how can i play it? some note has to be less important than another... so can i choose which one i miss.. like the one that i dont like ? biggrin.gif


Well, in this case you need them all as they all have a function.

D is the root.
F# is the 3rd which makes it major and not minor
A is the 5th - we rarely if ever miss out the 5th
C# is the major 7th, without this we couldn;t very well call it a Dmaj7+11
And Gis the 11th, a similar argument applies.

For more complex stacked chords like a regular 11thm you can miss out the 7th and 9th if you want to. Also, you can look at the chord in the context of the whole mix and in some cases other instruments can supply missing notes, allowing you to cut the guitar notes down to a manageable number.

QUOTE
and also he told me to start building a chord for example starting on the high e string but starting with the 5th up.. hmm im confused right now because how can i see fast which tone has to be the next one in line?
i tried it with intervalls but after some time i got stucked oO
do i have to move down in building order? so i start with the 5th than the 3rd than the root than the add11 and finally the maj7 ??


5th fret on the E string would be an A which is in our chord which is ok. The way to proceed from there is to move down a string, look what notes are within a few frets of the 5th, and add them in if they are in the chord. Eventually this way you can build up a whole chord. In fact, its best to make your lowest note the root, and try to keep extension notes such as 7,9,11 higher than the 3rd and 5th, but duplicating 3rd and 5th or root is always possible.

That's about it!

I discuss some of this in my lessons on 7ths and extended chords.

This post has been edited by Andrew Cockburn: Oct 17 2007, 03:59 AM


--------------------
Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ...

My Stuff:

Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass
Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon
Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood
Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Saoirse O'Shea
post Oct 17 2007, 05:16 AM
Post #3


Moderator - low level high stakes
Group Icon

Group: GMC Senior
Posts: 6.173
Joined: 27-June 07
From: Espania - Cadiz province
Member No.: 2.194



Just as a personal preference,
I don't find the Maj7+11 particularly nice if built from the root - to me it sounds nicer with the 5th in the bass. To me the root as bass sounds just to unresolved (and I like unresolved but this one hangs too much for me...). So I'd go with an inversion which may be what your teacher is after?

Personal preference though.

Maj7+11 is a 'strange' chord though.

Cheers,
Tony


--------------------
Get your music professionally mastered by anl AES registered Mastering Engineer. Contact me for Audio Mastering Services and Advice and visit our website www.miromastering.com

Be friends on facebook with us here.

We use professional, mastering grade hardware in our mastering studo. Our hardware includes:
Cranesong Avocet II Monitor Controller, Dangerous Music Liasion Insert Hardware Router, ATC SCM Pro Monitors, Lavry Black DA11, Prism Orpheus ADC/DAC, Gyratec Gyraf XIV Parallel Passive Mastering EQ, Great River MAQ 2NV Mastering EQ, Kush Clariphonic Parallel EQ Shelf, Maselec MLA-2 Mastering Compressor, API 2500 Mastering Compressor, Eventide Eclipse Reverb/Echo.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Giacinto
post Oct 17 2007, 04:40 PM
Post #4


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 189
Joined: 11-January 07
From: Germany
Member No.: 1.069



hey dudes thanks for your answers...
first of all: -> i had a c# ! cis= c# o.O
but you are right was to tired yesterday builded the minor not the major triad! hmm got everything very well explained thanks dudes!
-> "For more complex stacked chords like a regular 11thm you can miss out the 7th and 9th if you want to. Also, you can look at the chord in the context of the whole mix and in some cases other instruments can supply missing notes, allowing you to cut the guitar notes down to a manageable number." -> yeah this is exactly my question. why is there a 7th and 9th in a regular x11 chord? just to make it sound more full by supporting the normal root, 3rd, 5th, 11 ?

cheers
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Andrew Cockburn
post Oct 17 2007, 07:49 PM
Post #5


Moderation Policy Director
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 10.459
Joined: 6-February 07
From: CT, USA
Member No.: 1.167



QUOTE ([email protected] @ Oct 17 2007, 11:40 AM) *
hey dudes thanks for your answers...
first of all: -> i had a c# ! cis= c# o.O
but you are right was to tired yesterday builded the minor not the major triad! hmm got everything very well explained thanks dudes!
-> "For more complex stacked chords like a regular 11thm you can miss out the 7th and 9th if you want to. Also, you can look at the chord in the context of the whole mix and in some cases other instruments can supply missing notes, allowing you to cut the guitar notes down to a manageable number." -> yeah this is exactly my question. why is there a 7th and 9th in a regular x11 chord? just to make it sound more full by supporting the normal root, 3rd, 5th, 11 ?

cheers


Its just a different chord, there is no deep purpose behind it- you get a different effect from a +11 than a regular11th because of the extra notes - remember chords weren't specifically invented for guitars - on a piano for instance it is a lot easier to play these combinations of notes. For guitar sometimes we have to make compromises and leave notes out.


--------------------
Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ...

My Stuff:

Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass
Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon
Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood
Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Giacinto
post Oct 17 2007, 10:07 PM
Post #6


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 189
Joined: 11-January 07
From: Germany
Member No.: 1.069



ah okay..
so when i build a G11 i should try to include the 9th?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Andrew Cockburn
post Oct 18 2007, 01:17 AM
Post #7


Moderation Policy Director
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 10.459
Joined: 6-February 07
From: CT, USA
Member No.: 1.167



QUOTE ([email protected] @ Oct 17 2007, 05:07 PM) *
ah okay..
so when i build a G11 i should try to include the 9th?


Yes, G11 should ideally include a 7th and a 9th.


--------------------
Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ...

My Stuff:

Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass
Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon
Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood
Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Giacinto
post Oct 18 2007, 05:20 AM
Post #8


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 189
Joined: 11-January 07
From: Germany
Member No.: 1.069



well this helped me a lot thx andrew!
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Giacinto
post Oct 18 2007, 10:02 PM
Post #9


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 189
Joined: 11-January 07
From: Germany
Member No.: 1.069



ah andrew, me again biggrin.gif
do you know a side where to get some good chord voicings( i think its called voicing.. so some basic build up chord tap like in your chord lessons) from?
thanks!


chord tab*
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Freebird
post Dec 12 2007, 11:59 PM
Post #10


GMC:er
*

Group: Members
Posts: 146
Joined: 27-October 07
From: Milano, Italy!!
Member No.: 3.159



This will do to you!
http://www.all-guitar-chords.com/
Good luck smile.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Andrew Cockburn
post Dec 13 2007, 02:05 PM
Post #11


Moderation Policy Director
Group Icon

Group: GMC Instructor
Posts: 10.459
Joined: 6-February 07
From: CT, USA
Member No.: 1.167



QUOTE (Freebird @ Dec 12 2007, 05:59 PM) *
This will do to you!
http://www.all-guitar-chords.com/
Good luck smile.gif


Great site recomendation, thanks Freebird!

On a slightly different note, if you have GuitarPro, that has an excellent chord voicing function as well.


--------------------
Check out my Instructor profile
Live long and prosper ...

My Stuff:

Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass
Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon
Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood
Amps : Epiphone Valve Jnr & Head, Cockburn A.C.1, Cockburn A.C.2, Blackstar Club 50 Head & 4x12 Cab
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 


RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 24th May 2017 - 05:31 AM