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> Microphones And Mic'ing For Recording, perhaps all you want to know about guitar mic'ing...
Vinod Saranga
post May 10 2008, 03:17 AM
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Thanks Tony smile.gif
I wonder how you can write  smoothly very massive info into a few paragraphs and what a knowledge you got.

(I really like physics and maths.I am gald if you can send me the principle behind the proximity effect. biggrin.gif )

Thanks again smile.gif
Vinod


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Saoirse O'Shea
post May 10 2008, 05:51 AM
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Thanks for the compliments guys, appreciated smile.gif .

Vinod that may be the first time anyone's ever complimented me on brevity smile.gif. Probably comes from years of practice editing and proofreading other peoples' writing. My old thesis was nearly double the 'word limit' (about 130,000 words, limit was 60-70,000) albeit my external examiners told the examining University that it was the right length and succinct for the argument put across - which I guess was a nice way of saying the argument was too complicated laugh.gif .

Proximity effect - ummm - phase cancellation/addition caused where the source lies within or on the nodal length of the wave recorded. Long time since I did physics but I think that's ok as a definition.

Cheers,
Tony


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Vinod Saranga
post May 10 2008, 05:57 AM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ May 10 2008, 10:21 AM) *
Thanks for the compliments guys, appreciated smile.gif .

Vinod that may be the first time anyone's ever complimented me on brevity smile.gif . Probably comes from years of practice editing and proofreading other peoples' writing. My old thesis was nearly double the 'word limit' (about 130,000 words, limit was 60-70,000) albeit my external examiners told the examining University that it was the right length and succinct for the argument put across - which I guess was a nice way of saying the argument was too complicated laugh.gif .

Proximity effect - ummm - phase cancellation/addition caused where the source lies within or on the nodal length of the wave recorded. Long time since I did physics but I think that's ok as a definition.

Cheers,
Tony



laugh.gif

Hi frequencies have short nodal lenghts so there is more chance to cancellation am I right or blink.gif


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Saoirse O'Shea
post May 19 2008, 03:57 PM
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QUOTE (Vinod Saranga @ May 10 2008, 04:57 AM) *
laugh.gif

Hi frequencies have short nodal lenghts so there is more chance to cancellation am I right or blink.gif


Yes about the lengths but not sure about the chance for cancellation. I think partly since high frequency sounds tend to be omni directional whereas low frequency is more uni-directional. High frequency sort of radiates out as a sphere whereas low tends to project forward. So for the former you may get proximity on-axis but you will also pick up the same frequency from the off-axis that's gone backwards and off to the sides and not caused proximity (if that makes sense) whereas for the low frequency proximity becomes a big issue. For low frequency most of the off-axis went in the same direction and so have a v similar amount of time and distance to come to the same on-axis point as the on-axis wavefront; at the proximity point they are more likely to cross in phase and so you're more likely to end up with a boomey bass.

Since the frequencies produced by a guitar are often multiple - because you can play a chord and produce harmonics - then you end up having to deal with the 'worst case' - in this case the open string note and that then gives you the ps distance for proximity. For a guitar proximity is pretty much the bridge to nut string distance - 1 complete wave cycle of the open string note. So generally you need to place the mic either slightly within this distance or a little bit beyond.

Bleh - not a good explanation I'm afraid and not in a single line/sentence either rolleyes.gif



Cheers,
Tony

Long time since I did any physics though so not sure how accurate my 'explanation' is though smile.gif


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Vinod Saranga
post May 19 2008, 04:40 PM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ May 19 2008, 08:27 PM) *
Yes about the lengths but not sure about the chance for cancellation. I think partly since high frequency sounds tend to be omni directional whereas low frequency is more uni-directional. High frequency sort of radiates out as a sphere whereas low tends to project forward. So for the former you may get proximity on-axis but you will also pick up the same frequency from the off-axis that's gone backwards and off to the sides and not caused proximity (if that makes sense) whereas for the low frequency proximity becomes a big issue. For low frequency most of the off-axis went in the same direction and so have a v similar amount of time and distance to come to the same on-axis point as the on-axis wavefront; at the proximity point they are more likely to cross in phase and so you're more likely to end up with a boomey bass.

Since the frequencies produced by a guitar are often multiple - because you can play a chord and produce harmonics - then you end up having to deal with the 'worst case' - in this case the open string note and that then gives you the ps distance for proximity. For a guitar proximity is pretty much the bridge to nut string distance - 1 complete wave cycle of the open string note. So generally you need to place the mic either slightly within this distance or a little bit beyond.

Bleh - not a good explanation I'm afraid and not in a single line/sentence either rolleyes.gif



Cheers,
Tony

Long time since I did any physics though so not sure how accurate my 'explanation' is though smile.gif


Ah I wonder why I can't understand, it's not a good explanation laugh.gif laugh.gif



Thanks Tony I got some Idea smile.gif  

This post has been edited by Vinod Saranga: May 19 2008, 04:41 PM


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Vinod Saranga
post May 19 2008, 06:16 PM
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I think I've understood the case behind the proximity effect.

Sound is produced by two main events

1.Phase difference (bitween front & rear of the diaphragm)(frequency dependant)
2.Amplitude difference (bitween front & rear of the diaphragm)(frequency independant)


Amplitude component become negligible @ large distances.
So the sound is made by phase component.


phase differences of low frequencies are small.So when we close the source to the mic Dominant component of low frequencies is Amplitude one.That's make the proximity effect

Hope you understand it smile.gif

This post has been edited by Vinod Saranga: May 19 2008, 06:20 PM


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kaznie_NL
post May 19 2008, 06:26 PM
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Hi guys, this article is now turned in a Wiki: here it is https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/wiki/index.php/Microphone


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Vinod Saranga
post May 19 2008, 06:28 PM
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QUOTE (kaznie_NL @ May 19 2008, 10:56 PM) *
Hi guys, this article is now turned in a Wiki: here it is https://www.guitarmasterclass.net/wiki/index.php/Microphone


Great welldone smile.gif


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Falcon_itSELF
post Nov 3 2008, 06:24 PM
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Proximity effect is caused by the high/low freq and the phase cancelation in our pinna.

Close your eyes. You can indicate where is an ambulance because the siren have medium/high frequencies.

Why the siren doesn´t have too high and low freq? Cause isn´t directional freq.

Try again: ask for your friend to hide a subwoofer ( with hi cut in 100 hz )... Now close your eyes: Can you say where is it?

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