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> Quick Request, for Tony and/or Andrew
Chris Evans
post Nov 14 2007, 10:07 PM
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I wonder if I could upload here (if thats ok) a song I`ve been working on (not the whole thing just a snipet) to see if you can give me any hints, tips or advice on the mixing please.

thought I`d ask before just doing it smile.gif

Cheers
Chris


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Hemlok
post Nov 14 2007, 10:18 PM
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QUOTE (Smells @ Nov 14 2007, 09:07 PM) *
I wonder if I could upload here (if thats ok) a song I`ve been working on (not the whole thing just a snipet) to see if you can give me any hints, tips or advice on the mixing please.

thought I`d ask before just doing it smile.gif

Cheers
Chris


No need to ask! smile.gif We will be glad to hear it!! I have heard some of your playing already and it is really cool, can't wait to hear this.


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Nov 14 2007, 10:39 PM
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Sure np Smells - for me it works best if you do it as a wav so it's not cmpressed but mp3 is ok as well.

Cheers,
Tony


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Chris Evans
post Nov 14 2007, 10:42 PM
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Cheers Tony, as just a snipet a wav should be ok to do, shall do it later on when I get in from work, thanks


Thanks Hemlock, very kind of you m8


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Muris Varajic
post Nov 15 2007, 12:48 AM
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Why not???
It's recording thread!!! smile.gif


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Nov 15 2007, 12:52 AM
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Damn I thought it was a re-cording thread where we talk about jack leads and stuff sad.gif unsure.gif . Looks like I'm in the wrong place yet again!

Cheers,
Tony


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Muris Varajic
post Nov 15 2007, 01:20 AM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Nov 15 2007, 12:52 AM) *
Damn I thought it was a re-cording thread where we talk about jack leads and stuff sad.gif unsure.gif . Looks like I'm in the wrong place yet again!

Cheers,
Tony


laugh.gif Nope,you're at the right place Tony
and we are going to talk about another recording soon. wink.gif


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Chris Evans
post Nov 15 2007, 01:26 AM
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QUOTE (tonymiro @ Nov 14 2007, 11:52 PM) *
Damn I thought it was a re-cording thread where we talk about jack leads and stuff sad.gif unsure.gif . Looks like I'm in the wrong place yet again!

Cheers,
Tony

laugh.gif laugh.gif


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Chris Evans
post Nov 15 2007, 05:09 AM
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ok, here goes, basically what I`m not happy with is the vocals in the mix, no matter how much I mix, re record them they just dont seem to sit right to me, your opinion/s & advice will be gratefully recieved.,
I`ve almost given up on getting them mixed right coz I`m just never happy with them, they always seem to bit a bit muddy to me, I`m putting some of this down to

a. I`m just not a singer &
b. the listening to your own voice syndrome (if you know what I mean)

but what are your thoughts?

its just an a clip from the song starting really from the guitar solo into a verse and then a chorus.

(Tony, I`ve done this as an MP3 as the .wav was just too big an attachment to upload.)

thanks sad.gif

[attachment=2513:attachment]


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lefty01
post Nov 15 2007, 05:16 AM
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QUOTE (Smells @ Nov 14 2007, 11:09 PM) *
ok, here goes, basically what I`m not happy with is the vocals in the mix, no matter how much I mix, re record them they just dont seem to sit right to me, your opinion/s & advice will be gratefully recieved.,
I`ve almost given up on getting them mixed right coz I`m just never happy with them, they always seem to bit a bit muddy to me, I`m putting some of this down to

a. I`m just not a singer &
b. the listening to your own voice syndrome (if you know what I mean)

but what are your thoughts?

its just an a clip from the song starting really from the guitar solo into a verse and then a chorus.

(Tony, I`ve done this as an MP3 as the .wav was just too big an attachment to upload.)

thanks sad.gif

[attachment=2513:attachment]
Darn! Just when I thought I was getting somewhere with my playing! I gotta go and practice some more. biggrin.gif Great stuff. Rock on!!! smile.gif

This post has been edited by lefty01: Nov 15 2007, 05:17 AM
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Hemlok
post Nov 15 2007, 05:56 AM
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Wow! Excellent, the vocals are not as bad as you might think, they seem to fit it really good. Great work, can't wait to hear finished song.


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Chris Evans
post Nov 15 2007, 06:02 AM
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QUOTE (Hemlok @ Nov 15 2007, 04:56 AM) *
Wow! Excellent, the vocals are not as bad as you might think, they seem to fit it really good. Great work, can't wait to hear finished song.


Thanks Hemlok, the song is finished, I`m as happy as I`m gunna be with the backing just the vocals I`m not (and probably never will be laugh.gif ) happy with.


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Nov 15 2007, 07:14 AM
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Hi Smells,
First great playing mate and nice song.

I agree with you about the mix the vocals to me also don't sit well. I've listened to it through a couple of different headphones and monitors and still come to that conclusion. Same as you the overall picture I get is that it's muddy and the vocals lie to far back. As suggestions: - assuming you can't re-record (TBH re-record is the best option but might not be practical):

I think that the mid band is pretty busy and the vocals are really sitting in there with a lot of it sounds around the 1-3kHz band to me. If you have a separate vocal track you can check by sweeping the eq to find the actual sweetspot - but I think it's probably at about 800-1200 Hz (nearer 800 to my ears). The whole recording sounds pretty busy in the mid band around that region.

What I would do to make the vocals stand out a bit is to find the vocal sweet spot and then attenuate the same band for the other instruments by a few dB. (You could just boost the vocals but I prefer attenuation.) That should help to clear some space for the vocals. I'd also add a bit of gain to the eq at around 3 kHz again to let the vocals breath a bit. Don't do too much gain at 3 kHz or the mix will sound fatiguing. Adding small amounts of gain at two frequencies is better then more gain on one frequency btw.

I'd suggest some attenuation at 250 Hz to cut the mud, again some attenuation of the band below 125 would increase definition a bit - maybe try with a low Q value on the eq and attenuate a large region below 120 to start and if you haven't used any low shelving I'd shelf the recording below 70 Hz as a start.

In the mix I don't hear much top end shimmer - so a little boost over 7kHz might help lift cymbals in the mix.

Apart from the eq I'd mix the vocals centre and bring the guitars off centre in to the right and left field more. That will help definition as well.

Finally if you have a multiband compressor then I'd experiment with it on the bass. Try setting the low cross over at 120 Hz and the high at 3 kHz and compress using heavy compression at the low cross and a high ratio for the high end. Experiment though to see what works.

Experiment a bit as the playing is great and the mix isn't that far off mate.

Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Tony


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exorcyze
post Nov 15 2007, 07:15 AM
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I agree, I think the vocals fit the song well actually. The only thing I would say is that they seem a little far back in the mix to me.

Otherwise, sounds good! =)


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Chris Evans
post Nov 15 2007, 07:22 AM
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wow great reply Tony, I think I always tend to keep the vocals to the back coz kinda getting them lost makes em sound better laugh.gif

But thats not the exercise, so I know I gotta get it right, unfortunatly, I cant move the guitars any more, I`m using an eight track and I`ve had to bounce tracks around, I could try stretching a little further apart in cooledit I guess and putting it back, hmm might be worth giving a go.

Yes lots of mid frequency stuff going on for sure, I shall spend a bit of time with your suggestions.

I think actually what I might do is as you say, re record the vocals into cooledit, the eq on my 8 track is very limited, at least cooledit will give me a lot more options.

Thanks m8

Chris

*cheers exorcyze smile.gif


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Muris Varajic
post Nov 15 2007, 09:42 AM
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Awesome tune,guitars AND voice Chris!!! smile.gif

It fits really great into this type of song.
As Tony said,whole mix sounds a bit DARK and adding more highs might go well
to '"open" whole picture.
And yeah,maybe a just a little bit more vocal in the mix
but I have to say that I personally prefer it this way,
sort of 80's standard,vocal as an instrument,not vocal AND THEN band. wink.gif


Good job!!! smile.gif


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Chris Evans
post Nov 15 2007, 07:20 PM
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Thanks chaps,

I was virging on re recording the whole thing (still might blink.gif yep probably will laugh.gif )

Tony`s advice was gr8 and almost bang on with the vocal eq (I was very impressed ohmy.gif ) 700Hz!

Once I realised this I played around with the eq`s on the backing introducing a little more highs, and the vocals actually do stand out a little more without just being boosted in volume, before actually going for a full re-record I`m going to expand the backing track to try and push the guitars further left and right as Tony suggests to make a little more room and try just re recording the vocals again first.

was up till 1am last night playing with this, v tired this morning lol!

Thanks for the tips, advice and nice comments, I`ll post again when I`ve finished.
smile.gif

This post has been edited by Smells: Nov 15 2007, 07:25 PM


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Saoirse O'Shea
post Nov 15 2007, 07:33 PM
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Pleasure Smells,
phew, glad that my ears were about right for the eq sweetspot mate - everytime I watch X factor I think I've completely lost when the panel say 'That was a great performance yadda yadda yadda...' and I'm going 'What it was awful s/he was off key and there was yadda yadda yadda...' smile.gif .

The money no object items that would also help in future would be a good (or very good if you're rich) capacitor mic and preamp for the vocals. Something like a Neve 1073 and a Neumann 105 would be an absolute killer but your wife would divorce you tongue.gif once she saw the bill (about 3500euros) but any good vocal pre and a capacitor mic can really help with vocals - Focusrite do good preamps from around the 400 UK sterling mark. Maybe get the whole band to chip in as it would be, in my mind, a good long term investment for recording?

Cheers,
Tony


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Get your music professionally mastered by anl AES registered Mastering Engineer. Contact me for Audio Mastering Services and Advice and visit our website www.miromastering.com

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Chris Evans
post Nov 15 2007, 07:50 PM
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Yes I think I will have to invest at some point in at least a decent mic for recording, I`m just using a standard dynamic mic atm and know that some of my vocal problems stem from that (apart from the voice ofc!)

Its just an "on my own" type of project that I`ve been working on for a while, and yea, I`ve spent/spending a small fortune just lately and the "I need it to fulfill my creative potential" excuse just dont seem to be working as well lately with the wife laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif

thanks m8 really appreciate your help


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Chris Evans
post Nov 24 2007, 10:57 PM
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Hi Tony,

Well, I`ve spent many a late night since (as well as practicing of course) remixing and playing around with this track, I`ve messed around with the eq`s etc, I think the track (personally) sounds a lot brighter than it did before, I`ve not pushed the vocals as far forward as probably some people may like, mainly coz I hate my voice and the truth is I was straining a little bit (as you can probably hear) to hit some of the notes, but I think they are clearer than they where before, appreciate your opinion m8ty, and others ofc smile.gif

At some point I`m gunna re record this whole track, I`ve got some better equipment now and think I may as well make it sound the best it should smile.gif but with what I`ve got for the moment be good to see if I`m on the right lines. Its the full song this time.

[attachment=2673:attachment]

thanks
Chris


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