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> Announcement : Behavior Towards Instructors, All members should read this
Jesse
post Jan 6 2009, 04:03 PM
Post #121


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I didn't know there were this serious problems.:|

I didn't know there were this serious problems.:|


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Jeff
post Jan 6 2009, 04:06 PM
Post #122


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Criticism is like that friend who always asks to borrow something but never pays it back. Eventually you just ignore him. Encouragement works, criticism does not.
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Jesse
post Jan 6 2009, 04:19 PM
Post #123


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Constructive criticism!


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Dreamcatcher
post Jan 6 2009, 04:55 PM
Post #124


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I think saying a person sucks or dumping on them is just a totally wrong approach...simple enough...and that type of behavior should be dealt with truthfully. I don't think anyone here regards critisism as a bad thing as long as its constructive. I do not believe anyone is talking about censoring anyone who holds a different view or has used constructive critisism. As far as I am to understand its people who are just being malicious in nature and rude. I could be wrong but its how I see whats being said. Just respect others around you is a simple thing really.

Example1 "I think you should try to use less distortion in that piece it may bring out a little more clarity in that solo" (good example of how to constructivly critique)

Example2 "wow man you suck that distortion really is awful" Bad example of a critique

the first example points the person in the right direction...the second just puts them down and is a rude way to approach the situation.


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OrganisedConfusi...
post Jan 6 2009, 05:00 PM
Post #125


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QUOTE (Dreamcatcher @ Jan 6 2009, 03:55 PM) *
I think saying a person sucks or dumping on them is just a totally wrong approach...simple enough...and that type of behavior should be dealt with truthfully. I don't think anyone here regards critisism as a bad thing as long as its constructive. I do not believe anyone is talking about censoring anyone who holds a different view or has used constructive critisism. As far as I am to understand its people who are just being malicious in nature and rude. I could be wrong but its how I see whats being said. Just respect others around you is a simple thing really.

Example1 "I think you should try to use less distortion in that piece it may bring out a little more clarity in that solo" (good example of how to constructivly critique)

Example2 "wow man you suck that distortion really is awful" Bad example of a critique

the first example points the person in the right direction...the second just puts them down and is a rude way to approach the situation.

But what people are meaning is that on this site they'd feel the need to add "I think you should try to use less distortion in that piece it may bring out a little more clarity in that solo, but either way your playing is of godlike proportions"

That bit in bold just isn't needed.


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enforcer
post Jan 6 2009, 05:20 PM
Post #126


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As I feel I am now a part of this beautiful community, I felt the urge of commenting here.

I seriously believe that to be honest has nothing near to be rude. And as being rude is a subjective matter (you can call someone sob (sorry for that) and this person may still laugh with you, and call that another one and he'll try to murder you) there is no virtual limits to it. If it is allowed some people will keep going until the darkest depths of human imagination while others won't. And this will diminish the average quality in the forums and will start to ignite hostilities. I think that kind of behaviour is not acceptable even if it restricts your freedom of speech. But we are all intelligent sentient life forms here, and we can transform our raw output to a more polite form.

I strictly refuse that "motivation requires aggression" idea, yeah one effective way may be that, but it brings more problem than it actually solves and it is contagious, if you do that to someone, that will trigger the fact that he, in his turn, will do the same to anyone, and following that path will lead us to a GMC where everybody may be great players but unnecessary and meaningless rivalities arise. And really if you feel that you can not actually be comfortable without saying whatever you want, I see there a great problem for you, because living in a community has its prerequest of loosing the freedom of saying and doing whatever one wants. You can try it, but in the point of offending some other's freedom there will be consequences.


I want to finish my words with a quote of some green little creature who is known to be very wise and though jedi for almost 900 years:

"Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny..."



--------------------


incoming spoiler read it at your own risk!


Spoiler:


Vigier G.V Wood HH
American Stratocaster Maple Standart with X2N bridge pickups
Samwick Artist custom modified Baswood Lespaul with S.Duncan JB and N56 pickups
Self made Fretless Strat type made of Rosewood/Maple with self wound Neck and Ibanez V8 Bridge Pickups
Floor Pod 2.0 Amp Simulation System
Pod Xt Pro Rack Amp Simulation System
Digitech TSR 12 Rack Effect and Studio Reverb
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Morley Bad Horsie Wah Pedal
Behringer FB1010 Floor Board



it, surely, spoiled me!!!


and may the force be with you :)
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Dreamcatcher
post Jan 6 2009, 05:23 PM
Post #127


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yeah I agree ya don't have to over do it...unless thats how you feel...like on muris's GI submission...jaw dropping godlike guitar playing lol ...smile.gif

QUOTE
I want to finish my words with a quote of some green little creature who is known to be very wise and though jedi for almost 900 years:

"Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny..."


Uh-Oh...anyone seen a U turn around here anywhere????




This post has been edited by Dreamcatcher: Jan 6 2009, 05:28 PM


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skennington
post Jan 6 2009, 06:18 PM
Post #128


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I personally feel that Andrew has sumed it up in the first 3 sections of the posting guidelines....

The Rules

1. Always be aware that when writing as opposed to speaking, there are far more opportunities for misunderstandings. Emoticons go a long way to help with this, but always re-read your post before you hit the send button and ask yourself, could this be misunderstood?

2. Always positive feedback, never negative feedback! This doesn't mean that we always agree, and always say everything is great, its about the way we approach feedback and criticism. For example, if someone posts a recording of themselves and it has some flaws. Don't say "Dude, that sucked, you really need to learn to play". Say something like "Cool, a really good attempt, I liked the feel of it. I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work a little, and pay a little more attention to your vibrato". That second comment makes the player feel good about what he has achieved, and more importantly gives him some pointers for the future. The flip side of this is that if someone has taken time to give you feedback, you should thank them for it.

3. Disagree with respect. We don't always agree with each other - and debate is a great thing on GMC - it allows everyone to see all sides of an argument. If you disagree with someone don't get personal. Respect their point of view, and realize that what you say is just your point of view - both are valid. So instead of saying "you crazy fool, holding a pick like that is for monkeys", you could say "That's pretty unusual, I do it this way because it steadies my hand better and I can hybrid pick, but whatever works for you!"


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enforcer
post Jan 6 2009, 07:02 PM
Post #129


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QUOTE (Dreamcatcher @ Jan 6 2009, 06:23 PM) *
Uh-Oh...anyone seen a U turn around here anywhere????


You just missed the last turn before the bridge which is out. laugh.gif


--------------------


incoming spoiler read it at your own risk!


Spoiler:


Vigier G.V Wood HH
American Stratocaster Maple Standart with X2N bridge pickups
Samwick Artist custom modified Baswood Lespaul with S.Duncan JB and N56 pickups
Self made Fretless Strat type made of Rosewood/Maple with self wound Neck and Ibanez V8 Bridge Pickups
Floor Pod 2.0 Amp Simulation System
Pod Xt Pro Rack Amp Simulation System
Digitech TSR 12 Rack Effect and Studio Reverb
Behringer Composer Rack Compressor Expander
Morley Bad Horsie Wah Pedal
Behringer FB1010 Floor Board



it, surely, spoiled me!!!


and may the force be with you :)
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Marek Rojewski
post Jan 6 2009, 07:03 PM
Post #130


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QUOTE (skennington @ Jan 6 2009, 06:18 PM) *
Don't say "Dude, that sucked, you really need to learn to play". Say something like "Cool, a really good attempt, I liked the feel of it. I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work a little, and pay a little more attention to your vibrato".


You see, I can't say "Cool, a really good attempt, I liked the feel of it. I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work a little, and pay a little more attention to your vibrato" because for example I:
1. don't think it is cool
2. don't think it is a good attempt
3. didn't like it
4. I suggest to tighten up the rhythm work without adding the word "little"
5. I suggest to pay more attention to vibrato without adding the word "little".

Of course I won't write "ah dude, that sounded like a dying cat". Still I think a better way of commenting would be "I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work, and pay more attention to your vibrato. Here are some lessons that can help LINK LINK LINK, and remember to always use the metronome".

I know it is hard not to sound harsh, but writing fantasy stuff like "cool attempt" while I think it is a poor one is false...

IMPORTANT NOTE: I am writing this because we are theorizing here, not because I had such bad problems in the past.


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OrganisedConfusi...
post Jan 6 2009, 07:11 PM
Post #131


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QUOTE (Marek Rojewski @ Jan 6 2009, 06:03 PM) *
You see, I can't say "Cool, a really good attempt, I liked the feel of it. I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work a little, and pay a little more attention to your vibrato" because for example I:
1. don't think it is cool
2. don't think it is a good attempt
3. didn't like it
4. I suggest to tighten up the rhythm work without adding the word "little"
5. I suggest to pay more attention to vibrato without adding the word "little".

Of course I won't write "ah dude, that sounded like a dying cat". Still I think a better way of commenting would be "I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work, and pay more attention to your vibrato. Here are some lessons that can help LINK LINK LINK, and remember to always use the metronome".

I know it is hard not to sound harsh, but writing fantasy stuff like "cool attempt" while I think it is a poor one is false...

IMPORTANT NOTE: I am writing this because we are theorizing here, not because I had such bad problems in the past.

You'd say something like "You're trying to play too quickly for your current standard. I'd advise slowing it down by 10 bpm and play to a metronome and then speed up gradually until you can play at this speed. It will sharpen up your playing and you will certainly impress more people with your standard. Remember playing things smoothly and well is better than making sketchy quick recordings."

This basically is saying you don't think they did it well but with a bit of work they can do it and I did it politely or do you not agree?


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Marek Rojewski
post Jan 6 2009, 07:16 PM
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You are right OC, that comment would be better than the one I proposed, and we should aim at such standard. Still my comment wouldn't be the end of the world.


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Andrew Cockburn
post Jan 6 2009, 07:31 PM
Post #133


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QUOTE (Marek Rojewski @ Jan 6 2009, 01:03 PM) *
You see, I can't say "Cool, a really good attempt, I liked the feel of it. I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work a little, and pay a little more attention to your vibrato" because for example I:
1. don't think it is cool
2. don't think it is a good attempt
3. didn't like it
4. I suggest to tighten up the rhythm work without adding the word "little"
5. I suggest to pay more attention to vibrato without adding the word "little".

Of course I won't write "ah dude, that sounded like a dying cat". Still I think a better way of commenting would be "I would suggest you tighten up the rhythm work, and pay more attention to your vibrato. Here are some lessons that can help LINK LINK LINK, and remember to always use the metronome".

I know it is hard not to sound harsh, but writing fantasy stuff like "cool attempt" while I think it is a poor one is false...

IMPORTANT NOTE: I am writing this because we are theorizing here, not because I had such bad problems in the past.


That's the way I would have phrased it (I was writing the guidelines after all) but your way isn't essentially different - it is still helpful, just a little less adorned. OC's style of comment was also helpful.


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opeth.db
post Jan 6 2009, 08:02 PM
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Im gone for a couple of days and this happens? 133 posts on how to be polite? Wow.

To me the GMC philosphy is working. I like coming to a place where everyone is super nice. It makes it different than every flame site out there. And to be honest if I paying a monthly fee to be a part of this I expect it.

I'll go out on a limb where I was contacted about conduct that I did and It was held very professional by Andrew and I respect that out of a site. Rather than bringing into a public affair it was held privately. Albeit it was just a misunderstanding the fact on how it was handled was polite, nice and professional.

I hope this didn't have anything to do with my satch/coldplay posts! smile.gif I sitll love ya OC I mean Paul. laugh.gif

This post has been edited by opeth.db: Jan 6 2009, 08:03 PM


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showyourfist
post Jan 6 2009, 08:23 PM
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I'm a little confused huh.gif This thread was made over a year ago, has something else happened?


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Andrew Cockburn
post Jan 6 2009, 08:28 PM
Post #136


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QUOTE (showyourfist @ Jan 6 2009, 02:23 PM) *
I'm a little confused huh.gif This thread was made over a year ago, has something else happened?


No, nothing, someone just resurrected the thread is all!


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Live long and prosper ...

My Stuff:

Electric Guitars : Ibanez Jem7v, Line6 Variax 700, Fender Plus Strat with 57/62 Pickups, Line6 Variax 705 Bass
Acoustic Guitars : Taylor 816ce, Martin D-15, Line6 Variax Acoustic 300 Nylon
Effects : Line6 Helix, Keeley Modded Boss DS1, Keeley Modded Boss BD2, Keeley 4 knob compressor, Keeley OxBlood
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showyourfist
post Jan 6 2009, 08:35 PM
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QUOTE (Andrew Cockburn @ Jan 6 2009, 07:28 PM) *
No, nothing, someone just resurrected the thread is all!



So that's why I felt the strange sensation of nostalgia as I kept reading through tongue.gif

I'm sure I came across GMC a long time ago.




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Fsgdjv
post Jan 6 2009, 09:20 PM
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Is it only I who would feel more insulted by someone telling me "oh it's pretty good, but maybe you can start practicing like this, and remember to always practice with a metronome, and remember that wou use the left hand to fret the strings and the right hand to pick with if you're right handed" than someone just telling me "omg, you frikkin suck at this".

If someone is trying to be nice to me it always ends up sounding like they are holding even more critisism back.

I still think the current way things work on gmc are really good and I'd take this over the usual agressive atmosphere, but I thought I'd just add how I feel critisism should be done biggrin.gif



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Fran
post Jan 6 2009, 09:44 PM
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The rules just encourage constructive criticism, which means you can say whatever you want/think in order to help people, but not to bash them.

Pretty good rule in my opinion. That's one of the reasons GMC is a friendly place where we all feel good, and I guess we all want to stay that way smile.gif


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g-forcelover
post Jan 6 2009, 10:02 PM
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Also, we need to add that these rules apply for anybody that their playing on the forums.


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