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> Regarding Lydian Riffing Lesson, ...noticed something.
Caelumamittendum
post Jul 31 2008, 12:13 AM
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I know not whether this is meant to be or not, but it confuses me a bit.

In the GP file, the key is "E major", however, wouldn't that suggest that the lydian mode should be A lydian? Where as E lydian is a part or the B major key? Same goes for the change to Bb lydian, which is in the key of F major, where as the lydian mode of the stated Bb major key would be Eb lydian?

tongue.gif tongue.gif tongue.gif

Could you explain this to me? laugh.gif

This post has been edited by Caelumamittendum: Jul 31 2008, 12:14 AM


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Muris Varajic
post Jul 31 2008, 01:43 AM
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Spot on.

There are few systems how to notate modes.

First one,if it's E Lydian per example
then you take all signs from "mother" Ionian,
which is B Major,6 sharps.

Second one and the one I prefer actually,
to take it as a major which it is,a major mode,
and then putting #4 every time it appears,
to point at its flavor even more.

So when it says it's in key of E major,
you strum E chord and that's the root .
Play A# note and you have E Lydian,
play D note and you have E Mixolydian.

It shouldn't confuse you tho,
point is to understand the mode and its notes/flavors,
everything else is just the label,the name. smile.gif


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Caelumamittendum
post Jul 31 2008, 01:50 AM
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Well, I'm not confused to the extent that I don't understand the the lydian mode or other modes. I was just not aware if it was by accident or by purpose.

I can understand why your way of approaching this makes more sense. It definately outlines it more.

Thanks for clarifying it. Now I will go back to troubling my head with time travelling. I'm even trying to send an email to Ronald Mallett wink.gif


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Muris Varajic
post Jul 31 2008, 02:46 PM
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Ahh, no chance to write something like this by accident. biggrin.gif

By the way,if you say it's in key of B
while trying to show E Lydian to someone,
well,you might miss the whole point
and show nothing to him/her. smile.gif


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Caelumamittendum
post Jul 31 2008, 03:17 PM
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I agree, now...

Had it been E phrygian, you would have set the key to E minor, right?


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Muris Varajic
post Jul 31 2008, 03:32 PM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Jul 31 2008, 04:17 PM) *
I agree, now...

Had it been E phrygian, you would have set the key to E minor, right?


I would,with resolving F# to F each time in notation if needed,
but I surely wont be saying key of C. smile.gif


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Caelumamittendum
post Jul 31 2008, 03:44 PM
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QUOTE (Muris Varajic @ Jul 31 2008, 04:32 PM) *
I would,with resolving F# to F each time in notation if needed,
but I surely wont be saying key of C. smile.gif


Clearly. I fully understand this now. smile.gif

EDIT: No, wait... what would one do in the case of say... E phrygian dominant?

This post has been edited by Caelumamittendum: Jul 31 2008, 03:45 PM


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Muris Varajic
post Jul 31 2008, 04:00 PM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Jul 31 2008, 04:44 PM) *
Clearly. I fully understand this now. smile.gif

EDIT: No, wait... what would one do in the case of say... E phrygian dominant?



Well,I would say key of E once more but only IF E phrygian is the root.
If it's just momentary there and then you have Am after
then it's key of Am.

Rule is,listen to whole tune,not just part of it,
the safest way to decide which key is it. smile.gif


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Caelumamittendum
post Jul 31 2008, 04:08 PM
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QUOTE (Muris Varajic @ Jul 31 2008, 05:00 PM) *
Well,I would say key of E once more but only IF E phrygian is the root.


Of course, clearly.

QUOTE
If it's just momentary there and then you have Am after
then it's key of Am.


That would be if you have a progression in the key/mode of A aeolian, where you would include a chord such as Em, which would leave with a momentarily E phrygian sound, right?

QUOTE
Rule is,listen to whole tune,not just part of it,
the safest way to decide which key is it. smile.gif


Of course, no need for changing key each time you change chords laugh.gif


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Muris Varajic
post Jul 31 2008, 04:40 PM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Jul 31 2008, 05:08 PM) *
That would be if you have a progression in the key/mode of A aeolian, where you would include a chord such as Em, which would leave with a momentarily E phrygian sound, right?


No need for Em chord,just E chord. smile.gif
When you say key of Am then Am chord is the root
and you can have Em chord as minor dominant chord or
E chord as major dominant chord.
But both versions are key of Am.


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Caelumamittendum
post Jul 31 2008, 04:54 PM
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QUOTE (Muris Varajic @ Jul 31 2008, 05:40 PM) *
No need for Em chord,just E chord. smile.gif
When you say key of Am then Am chord is the root
and you can have Em chord as minor dominant chord or
E chord as major dominant chord.
But both versions are key of Am.


Oh, sure, on the phrygian dominant it's an E chord. Holding together my music terms in the heat is quite a challenge. Had we been playing the key of Am, with Am as root chord, and we wanted to incorporate the E phrygian, the chord would be Em, right? In Phrygian major it would be E...?

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Muris Varajic
post Aug 1 2008, 12:05 AM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Jul 31 2008, 05:54 PM) *
Oh, sure, on the phrygian dominant it's an E chord. Holding together my music terms in the heat is quite a challenge. Had we been playing the key of Am, with Am as root chord, and we wanted to incorporate the E phrygian, the chord would be Em, right? In Phrygian major it would be E...?

smile.gif


Well no need to incorporate
E Phrygian in key of Am,
you already said that we shouldn't use different mode
each time we change the chord. biggrin.gif
But it would be Em chord,yes. smile.gif


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Caelumamittendum
post Aug 1 2008, 12:16 AM
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QUOTE (Muris Varajic @ Aug 1 2008, 01:05 AM) *
Well no need to incorporate
E Phrygian in key of Am,
you already said that we shouldn't use different mode
each time we change the chord. biggrin.gif
But it would be Em chord,yes. smile.gif


Yeah, I wouldn't be changing the key from Am to Em in that section. But if we were in a chord progression with Am as root, and they chord change then went to Em and we wanted to archive a phrygian sound, we would have to put emphasis on those notes that states the Phrygian sound, right? Which would be the F?

Did that make sense?

Actually another thing, I've yet to really grasp is what exact notes makes the modes differ from eachother. Like...in lydian you would put emphasis on the 4th.


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Muris Varajic
post Aug 1 2008, 12:42 AM
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QUOTE (Caelumamittendum @ Aug 1 2008, 01:16 AM) *
Yeah, I wouldn't be changing the key from Am to Em in that section. But if we were in a chord progression with Am as root, and they chord change then went to Em and we wanted to archive a phrygian sound, we would have to put emphasis on those notes that states the Phrygian sound, right? Which would be the F?

Did that make sense?

Actually another thing, I've yet to really grasp is what exact notes makes the modes differ from eachother. Like...in lydian you would put emphasis on the 4th.


Yes,for Lydian it would be #4.
But it's very important not to lay on it too often,
sounds a bit naive if you ask me.
Play it just like any other scale's note in order
to make nice melody,don't play perfect 4th and you're good.

As for phrygian,it would be F in E phrygian,minor 2nd,yes. smile.gif


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