Obama Or Mccain (vote Now) |
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Nov 4 2008, 07:31 PM
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QUOTE (fkalich @ Nov 4 2008, 01:01 PM)  You are saying nationalize it but don't nationalize it. For all practical purposes, controlling prices means nationalization. We could discuss that ... I don't claim to have all the answers, but by controlling prices I am talking about effects not necessarily government policies. In capitalists societies, costs are generally controlled through competition - why isn't that working here? That's the sort of question I would prefer to ask and address ahead of taking the whole industry public. I am by no means an expert in US health finance though, so maybe this is a naive assumption on my part. QUOTE When anyone wants to tell me how great our system is compared to others, I like to show them this chart, and have them explain why that is. [attachment=10991:cost_longlife75.gif] At first sight that's a compelling chart - but its really just a soundbite, or should that be eye-bite? As you and I know the reality is way more complex than that. It could mean what you want it to mean, or it could mean that homeless beggars in Spain live longer with no legs and chronic diseases, than people in the US that benefit from artificial limbs and antibiotics - my point being that length of life is not necessarily the only measure of the effectiveness of health care. One thing that graph does very clearly show is that the US does pay way more on health care than anywhere else, and here I agree with you - whatever reform takes place it should be aimed towards extracting value from that money for the end users of the health care, and making it more accessible. I'm not however a believer in the extreme opposite to this that nationalised healthcare represents, as it is hard to do it well. To be fair, I have heard talk that France has an exceptional nationally run health service, so it sounds like it is possible, although I also believe that France has way higher taxes than the US and I'm not a Tax & Spend kind of guy. -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
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Nov 4 2008, 07:38 PM
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Ok, this is starting to become a shouting match - lets steer clear of insulting the candidate please ...
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Nov 4 2008, 07:40 PM
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QUOTE (fkalich @ Nov 4 2008, 08:43 AM) If you have not voted, you probably have seen this, but just a reminder of what we are a 72 year old's heart beat away from if McCain were to win..... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjZW4z9zqqY QUOTE (fkalich @ Nov 4 2008, 10:35 AM) "Better to keep your mouth closed and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt"? --Mark Twain Amen -------------------- Schecter Exotic Star+ Peavey VK
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Nov 4 2008, 07:42 PM
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QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Nov 4 2008, 01:39 PM) Picture a world without American extremism (aka terrorism).. It's the same thing. You can't lump people together just like Andrew said to me. There are extremists in every country and in every religious background. I hate it when people are racist and just mention Islamic Extremism. It's this closed mind that led to the war in Iraq. There are extremists in all countries and of all cultures and background. Just because I'm not a terrorist doesn't mean all the English Agnostics are not terrorists. And this isn't having a go it's just saying don't lump people together. I tend to do it too much also  Heh, you just made me proud OC 
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Nov 4 2008, 08:09 PM
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QUOTE (OrganisedConfusion @ Nov 4 2008, 02:04 PM) From an outsiders view this doesn't even look close. Is this wrong or has Obama got a good lead certainly? Most of the latest pols put them within the margin for error, but most of them put Obama slightly ahead, so he probably is marginally ahead in truth. -------------------- Check out my Instructor profile
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Nov 4 2008, 09:51 PM
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Obama is an ultra-liberal socialist... A change is good, but this wouldn't be a change for the better.
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