New Pc Purchase Options

[Storm Linnebjerg]

I'm copying my thread from the Reaper forum into here. Perhaps it could be valuable for people to follow along with my decision here:

I decided to ask at the Reaper forum, as they are similar users to me. I've asked my gaming friends, but they tend to push towards gaming setup, prioritizing newer graphics cards etc. like the RTX3080 (around $950 here), which I don't think is needed for my use. See below for further detail

------------------------

Thread:

"I've been (un)fortunate enough to get a small sum of money from the insurance company due to theft. Nothing grand, but about enough for a good new PC. My old one (parts from late 2015 ish) is creeping towards the end of its lifetime and I'm looking to future-proof for a bit again (tend to run for around 7 years before upgrading). Currently on an i7 6700k, 32 GB DDR4 2400 mHz RAM, RTX 2070 Super etc. Given that the 6th gen Intels are not currently capable of running Windows 11, I'd be looking at buying a new PC or parts in 1-2 years anyway, which would mean motherboard, CPU etc. Thinking about grabbing the chance now and just making a big overhaul.

I'm thinking about skipping out on getting a new GPU and keeping my 2070 Super, as I don't game much*, and I think it should cover my relatively few needs and tie me over till i.e. a 3080 possibly drops further in a couple of years.

CPU:
CPU wise I'm reading i9 12900k could possibly be the superior choice to i7 12700k, but I'm also reading that the i7 should be enough for most users and that single core speed is more important. I'm able to fit either into my budget, as long as I'm skipping out on buying a graphics card and keeping my 2070 Super. That's of course not evening mention AMD options, but I'm not updated on that, besides maybe the 5950x or 5800x as an option?

Here's a bit about my Reaper usage:
I mostly run VST plugins for drums (Superior Drummer 3 and expansions), Trillian for bass, Omnisphere for keyboard, sometimes East West (Composer cloud) for other things, various vocal plugins and such besides individual plugins (Waves and similar) on busses, channels or master. Neural DSP, Bias and the like for guitars if I'm not mic'ing up my amp. I've already got a Steinberg UR816C audio interface that I'm quite comfortable with, so no need to worry about that. So the question is: Do I go i9 or i7?

RAM:
From what I understand DDR5 is still in its infancy and it might be worth it to stick with DDR4 for now, but I do see a few comparisons saying DDR5 has a tiny advantage over DDR4. DDR5 or DDR4?
I'd probably be looking at 64GB of DDR4 RAM or 32GB of DDR5. What would be the best choice here also in regards to future proofing - i.e. choosing a DDR5 motherboard or seeing how far DDR4 gets me?
There's also the possibility of keeping my 32 GB DDR4 2400 mhz RAM and perhaps adding 32 more.

Hard drives/SSD/storage:
I'm not overly concerned with speed, but of course it's always nice, so SSD or NVME? I've read about the newer NVME's like Samsung 980 Pro etc. Is it worth making that jump or is it overkill in terms of music production? Currently on a relatively small SSD for my OS (256GB) and older HDDs for everything else. I'd possibly get a 4TB storage HDD while I'm at it - or at first keep my 2+1 TB HDDs around.

Cooling, noise and case:
Is it worth going water cooling in terms of noise? What about case and such? Not looking for anything fancy RGB. Just plain and simple will do.
I've currently got a regular air CPU fan (arctic freeze) and a Cooler Master Silencio 550 case. Wouldn't mind upgrading the case while I'm at it and possible going water cooling if it's quiter etc.

Other not too important mentions:
Recently bought an ultrawide monitor which I'm very happy with - coming from a 2 monitor setup with a 1440x900 and an Aldi TV - to a triple monitor setup (previous 2 plus the ultrawide as the main one now), I'm not looking to upgrade my computer monitors.

If I have overlooked important parts and decisions feel free to suggest them of course!

Thanks!

EDIT: I made it sound like money isn't an issue. That's of course not the case. My budget is just below $2000 for what it's worth.

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*I do play the occasional game, but I think my 2070 Super will suffice (i.e. older retro games, but sometimes games like Red Dead Redemption 2, Witcher 3, Final Fantasy 7 Remake and such), but it's not a priority and I'd rather spend money on getting a good CPU etc. for music production."

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This post has been edited by Storm Linnebjerg: Sep 16 2022, 02:25 AM

[Storm Linnebjerg]

Getting some nice replies here:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=270745

Most of my tech-savvy friends are more gaming-orientated, and less so music, so it's interesting to maybe get a perspective from people that are more like me; music-production orientated and casual gaming if even that.

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[Mertay]

My info isn't really up-to-date but from what I remember through friends comments;

CPU; While AMD has faster peak response, inter seems a bit better on longer uses. I mean in games at times cpu's need a speed boost where AMD wins but for music continual performance is more important.

I'd search for info on is i9 has any heat issues or need expensive cooling. But yes a modern i7 for music should be very good too.

RAM Minimum 32gb is a good idea as even plug-ins these days (to be 4k compatible or resizeable) may need more ram than the past but I don't know if that ram is needed from the graphics or computer ram. Not really sure if fast ram for music has big benefits. There are cheap Graphics cards with more ram but I'm really not good in that area of what is good.

I'd try investing SSD storage for sample libraries (superior drummer, east-west etc.) for faster load times rather than pay more on M2 that will only be used but the system. For system a Samsung SSD is the safes but for storing sample libraries (since not much will be written but rather ead) cheaper SSD's could be a better idea. For saving old projects etc. ofcourse keeping old HDD's is safe.

They say water cooling is a bit more quiet but most also say its not worth it as for expense or installation is a bit harder. If I'd go shopping today would probably get an ok fan an a semi-silent case as some cases have minor sound reduction to my knowledge.

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This post has been edited by Mertay: Sep 17 2022, 02:42 PM

[jstcrsn]

even with the minimums you mentioned will be enough as long as you get thunderbolt connectivity , I believe your set up is like mine.. midi drums ,bass , multiple guitar tracks and solos running plugins, yes you can freeze tracks but if you need to change , you un freeze and that slows work progrees which sometimes ruins the day. I have I7 ,32 ram and pcie-ssd and hardlyu ever glitch , but that ! 1 solo i finally got right but I forgot to freeze enough tracks to not glitch and I punch my self for not spending 100 bucks for a thunderbolt. your 2070 will be plenty as it does affect it a little , but once you are above 1060 i think it's enough

P.S. not matter how fast your computer is it can not change the size of the 'box' sending info thru USB of course if you have it already you don't need to read this

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This post has been edited by jstcrsn: Sep 17 2022, 10:27 PM

[Storm Linnebjerg]

even with the minimums you mentioned will be enough as long as you get thunderbolt connectivity , I believe your set up is like mine.. midi drums ,bass , multiple guitar tracks and solos running plugins, yes you can freeze tracks but if you need to change , you un freeze and that slows work progrees which sometimes ruins the day. I have I7 ,32 ram and pcie-ssd and hardlyu ever glitch , but that ! 1 solo i finally got right but I forgot to freeze enough tracks to not glitch and I punch my self for not spending 100 bucks for a thunderbolt. your 2070 will be plenty as it does affect it a little , but once you are above 1060 i think it's enough

P.S. not matter how fast your computer is it can not change the size of the 'box' sending info thru USB of course if you have it already you don't need to read this

I know you've had a problem with your USB connection. I never had a problem with either USB 2 or USB 3 audio cards (Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 and Steinberg UR816C now) even with projects upwards of 100 tracks. Newer motherboards do have TB4 though. My main problem now is CPU keeping up with projects.

Also, just curious, did you end up buying a desktop or laptop last time around? I remember you talking about buying a laptop.

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This post has been edited by Storm Linnebjerg: Sep 17 2022, 11:42 PM

[jstcrsn]

I know you've had a problem with your USB connection. I never had a problem with either USB 2 or USB 3 audio cards (Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 and Steinberg UR816C now) even with projects upwards of 100 tracks. Newer motherboards do have TB4 though. My main problem now is CPU keeping up with projects.

Also, just curious, did you end up buying a desktop or laptop last time around? I remember you talking about buying a laptop.

I bought a laptop so i was not locked down to a desk/place.

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[Storm Linnebjerg]

I bought a laptop so i was not locked down to a desk/place.

Ah, right! Yeah, I'm buying/building a desktop for my home studio - not that it matters that much, I suppose. I understand the benefits of being able to move a laptop around though.

Even though I'm not going Thunderbolt (as my audio interface is USB 3.1 - and I haven't run into issues in regards to that), I think the motherboards I've been looking at have thunderbolt connectors if it does become something I need. The Z690: https://www.asus.com/Motherboards-Component...RIME-Z690-P-D4/

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[jstcrsn]

Ah, right! Yeah, I'm buying/building a desktop for my home studio - not that it matters that much, I suppose. I understand the benefits of being able to move a laptop around though.

Even though I'm not going Thunderbolt (as my audio interface is USB 3.1 - and I haven't run into issues in regards to that), I think the motherboards I've been looking at have thunderbolt connectors if it does become something I need. The Z690: https://www.asus.com/Motherboards-Component...RIME-Z690-P-D4/

If I ever get another pc it will be a desktop, definitely for a more customizable 'experience'.. I am sure that mother board will do

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[Storm Linnebjerg]

If I ever get another pc it will be a desktop, definitely for a more customizable 'experience'.. I am sure that mother board will do

Yeah, I'm "lucky" enough to just be all by myself in my house, so I don't need to find a small corner for a laptop I'm just kidding, I just know you have a few kids, so I imagine it can be difficult to find space for one self sometimes

---

No longer a reply to jstcrsn, just general talk:

For what it's worth it seems people at the Reaper forum suggests to wait till the 13th gen Intel CPUs come out in a few weeks - or go for the 7000-series AMD. The 7000 series will support DDR5 ram too. Their current gen (5000 series) doesn't, where as current Intel 12th supports DDR5.

It might not be needed to go DDR5 just yet, but alternatively I'd end up buying a motherboard that only does DDR4, then needing to upgrade that AND the DDR4 ram to DDR5 in some years. Might as well jump on the wave now with a newer motherboard and then later on only have to upgrade the ram and not both.

Since I have my RTX 2070 Super I don't need to spend ~900 USD of my budget a better graphics card. I don't even game that much and my current graphics card is absolutely fine for me. That means I can go top of the line CPU, like the Intel i9 13900k and stay within my budget. Same with other things.

From what I'm reading AMD excels in certain aspects, but Intel overall probably does better. But it's hard to figure out. I don't think it will be a problem regardless what I go for, as both are top of the line - both the Ryzen 9 7950x and the i9 13900k.

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This post has been edited by Storm Linnebjerg: Sep 18 2022, 07:32 PM

[PosterBoy]

I'll be watching this with interest my pc is one I built around 2015 too. and I'm also a casual gamer.

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[Storm Linnebjerg]

I'll be watching this with interest my pc is one I built around 2015 too. and I'm also a casual gamer.

The new AMDs should be out Tuesday and I think it's likely that Intel will officially present their new chips too.

For what it's worth, just some news from the last days:
https://wccftech.com/intel-core-i9-13900k-s...mark-benchmark/

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[Storm Linnebjerg]

I'll be watching this with interest my pc is one I built around 2015 too. and I'm also a casual gamer.

There's been a few more posts back and forth on the Reaper forum. I'll send the link here again, cause there's too much to copy/paste in here:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=2...375#post2600375

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This post has been edited by Storm Linnebjerg: Sep 29 2022, 07:23 AM

[Storm Linnebjerg]

The new Intel's came out yesterday and...

...for what it's worth I ended up going for the i9-13900K. Maybe it was a bit hasty, but it was what I had planned for and what I still just about had the money for, and with unforeseen things (cat having to be put down) they seemed to slip away from me, so decided to act now.

I went with 32 GB of DDR5 5600 MHz. I can always upgrade that later. 1 TB NVMe PCIe 4.0 SSD. 850W 80+ Gold power supply. Z690 motherboard... ehr... and keeping my RTX 2070 Super.

I'm gonna transfer some of the case fans from my current case to the new one (mine are better), as well as maybe add a few more to the new one. It's a "silent case", but it has a few more spots for case fans than my current case does, and from what I can gather case airflow is important in those as much as proper CPU cooling as well, where I've opted for aircooling.

I know the 13900k seem to have some issues with getting too hot and throttling at 100C under stress tests, but I don't know how often I'll be pushing it to that level. Otherwise perhaps something like a Noctua NH-D15 might be an option - or at the very least the Arctic Freeze e-sport duo that I currently have.

Should be here around 1st of November. There are so many opinions and experiences out there (not a bad thing), but it seems to change daily what people have suggested me and in the end I went with what my "gut feeling" and my own "research" had suggested me. Sometimes you gotta trust our own instinct, I suppose, as people seem to each suggest their own thing.

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This post has been edited by Storm Linnebjerg: Oct 23 2022, 09:06 AM

[PosterBoy]

It's so easy to overthink these things and go round and round in circles.

Congratulations on sticking to a decision

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[FreePizza]

The new Intel's came out yesterday and...

Congratulations on your purchase, Ben. It's a tough decision to make. I am running a ryzen 5 3600, 16GB, 1TB nvme and an RTX 2070 Super like yourself. Also a gamer but don't feel the need to upgrade just yet. Soon enough I will be upgrading my mobo/CPU, PS and graphics card though. Hopefully these Lovelace cards bring the Ampere prices down. It'd be great to find a deal on a 3080. Enjoy the new hardware, would love to see pics when you put everything together.

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This post has been edited by FreePizza: Oct 23 2022, 01:50 PM

[Storm Linnebjerg]

It's so easy to overthink these things and go round and round in circles.

Congratulations on sticking to a decision

Yeah, sometimes you have to just stick by it. Some people were saying "don't go Intel, go AMD", others were saying "Intel is much better for content creation". Some people were telling me I needed to upgrade my 2070 Super even though I barely do any gaming. Some people were telling me to go DDR4 and a motherboard supporting that instead of DDR5, and some were saying the opposite. I think I'll be happy with my choice though Only concern is that the i9-13900k can run quite hot, but it's possible to lock it to around 125W if I recall correctly, without losing more than 1-2% of performance according to people, instead of letting it run to 278W or so, which can be difficult to keep cool. It doesn't throttle till it hits 100C though, from what I'm reading, but still worth keeping cool for longevity, I suppose.

Congratulations on your purchase, Ben. It's a tough decision to make. I am running a ryzen 5 3600, 16GB, 1TB nvme and an RTX 2070 Super like yourself. Also a gamer but don't feel the need to upgrade just yet. Soon enough I will be upgrading my mobo/CPU, PS and graphics card though. Hopefully these Lovelace cards bring the Ampere prices down. It'd be great to find a deal on a 3080. Enjoy the new hardware, would love to see pics when you put everything together.

Yeah, I was looking at AMD's too, but I've always been an Intel kinda guy. However, at the end of the day I think the performance is very similar on the top models of AMD/Intel. That's what I'm reading too from what seems more non-partial people. And yeah, if I had chosen to get a 3080 as well, I'd have had to pay 875 USD more. For my usage it wasn't needed for now, so that's something for the future. I ordered it from a company that put it together for me, and they're a very trusted company. They're preparing it for me to just insert my 2070 Super as well. I don't have a problem putting things together myself, and I've had my current PC completely apart and put together, but price-wise there wasn't really any difference according to PCPartpicker. If anything it was possibly a bit cheaper, but all in all within about 25 USD difference +/-. And in this way I know it will arrive fully working and I won't have to wait for individual parts to arrive. My friend was waiting about 4 weeks for a PSU not long ago after he upgraded his PC and ordered parts individually.

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[Storm Linnebjerg]

New PC arrived today. Seems to be running very smooth! I moved my Nvidia RTX 2070 Super over to the new one along with my HDDs and SSD, as well as my Noctua case fans. Airflow seems much better than my old one and of course the CPU runs smooth as butter. Haven't really tested it yet, as I've only just turned it on and started installing a few things. So far so good!

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[FreePizza]

Awesome, congratulations! Nothing like the feeling of a new rig.

New PC arrived today. Seems to be running very smooth! I moved my Nvidia RTX 2070 Super over to the new one along with my HDDs and SSD, as well as my Noctua case fans. Airflow seems much better than my old one and of course the CPU runs smooth as butter. Haven't really tested it yet, as I've only just turned it on and started installing a few things. So far so good!

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[FreePizza]

Just did a rebuild on Friday with new parts. It's running super smooth and I am pretty happy with the performance.

Ryzen 7 5700X with an Arctic Freezer 34 Duo, 32GB, an ASUS TUF RTX 4070 Ti, and an 850W PSU. I carried over the case and Nvme SSD/SATA SSD from my previous build.

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This post has been edited by FreePizza: Mar 13 2023, 01:31 AM

[sumitnxt]

that PC is good to play all games in 4K for next 2 years.

Just did a rebuild on Friday with new parts. It's running super smooth and I am pretty happy with the performance.

Ryzen 7 5700X with an Arctic Freezer 34 Duo, 32GB, an ASUS TUF RTX 4070 Ti, and an 850W PSU. I carried over the case and Nvme SSD/SATA SSD from my previous build.

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