Hone Your Tone - Episode #2, get some tips on how to improve your tone |
|
Hone Your Tone - Episode #2, get some tips on how to improve your tone |
|
|
|
|
Nov 8 2015, 04:42 PM |
Hello Darius, As you kindly propose it, let's talk about and try to improve my tone(s).... First of all I would like to get an audio track with your guitar only (no additional instruments) Your signal chain looks ok - most common tools in use with no not necessary stopms/fx etc. That's a good starting point. Guitar and pickups do affect the tone of course but the exact issue I've mentioned was not so much depending on those two. It was more a matter of post processing. You need to realize that eq settings from a live amp we hear has nothing to do with what we get through a guitar microphone. Your amplifier settings look ok for a live playing but we need to make them sound god thourgh a mic - doesn't matter if it's real mic or whole thing is done with plug-ins. Rules are basicly the same. If You are not familiar with advanced use of eq, then a tip that usually work for me (considering placement of the mic you showed on the screen - between cap and cone) I would suggest to make a radical boost od middle and radical cut on the treble know of amp sim. For me it worked this way - I wanted to make my recording sound like my amp with a falt/dafautl eq setting (every eq knob on the 12 o'clock). To compensate the way - harsh way) microphone colorize the tone, I had too bosst the middle and almost fully cut the treble. Then it sounded close to what I would expect. You will also need to find out (I suppose it has to be somewhere in your guitar rig since it's a "must have" tool for mixing guitar tone) where is LPF (Low Pass Filter) I believe the parametric eq you have on your screen should have such an option as "high cut" or "LPF". Doing those two things (for example middle to 100% and treble to 0%) + LPF set to 5-6 kHz should be a good fix for the tone you have (it isn't that bad at all, only need to get rid of some harshness Hi!, For me the decision is easy. Plugin time!. With my focusrite I can play realtime with a stack of several plugins without noticiable delay, so, I-m ok {Or I think so...}. I must say I have been using Lepou plugin with a screamer tube for Gab's Anvil lesson and my result tone is not the same. I can confirm plugins are stacked in the same orther in Renoise. Well I have decided Darius... lets see what we can achieve. Im really excited. Cheers. Great! Now I need a screen of your example tone made with plaug-in so I could spot any essential mistakes (if there are any). I would suggest to try to get Poulin HyBrit and LexTac. Those amps will be able to give you tone type close to how your valvastate sounds. Also...Try to get somewhere in the net a pack of "catharsis guitar cab impulses". Impulse called "1on-pres5" is a good choice for less post processing to get descent tone. Alwasy remember to set the mix option to 100% if You use Kefir impulse loader Hi Darius, this is really awesome of you and I wanted to get some feedback too. I have been working on Piotr's Winter Tune II and wanted to get some help with my rhythm and solo tones. They are my two main sounds and I use them in a lot of lessons. I get good feedback on them, but I still think they have lots of room to improve. The rhythm sound seems to get a bit muddy and the solo tone could use some more sustain, among other things. Any tips would be awesome, here are my files: Hey there! Wellcome in the thread! Your solo tone sound a bit thin (sound like there is a lot going on in the high mids instead of low mids where all the "juice" come from) I would suggest to abandon any kind of POD post eq devices (like those two in your rhythm tone for example) and start from doing a lot of test changin only amps, cabs and mic (type and placement). Your rhythm tone sounda very compressed. Threadplate (MEsa sim) is a good choice but I'm not sure about using condenser mic simulation. Let's start our work from those particular steps in both cases - solo and rhythm tones 1. Set all know (aside from gain which is a matter of your choice) to 12 o'clock 2. Remove all eq plug-ins from the singal chain 3. Switch for a dynamic microphone in your rhythm section 4. Send me short samples of how does this sound with amentioned above "flat" settings. This way I'll know the direction to lead you further |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Nov 8 2015, 06:03 PM |
Hello,
Please find my dry track here. I've made a rendering with no boost, treble 0, mids 100 and LPF at 5 Khz. The result is in attachment too :-) Question: If I want to create a blues sound, a clean/crunch sound, a lead sound, would you stick to the same amp simulation ? Tnx a lot for your time !! JL This post has been edited by krakou: Nov 8 2015, 06:33 PM
Attached image(s)
Attached File(s)
Guitar_Piano_HoneTone_Dry.wav ( 19.97MB )
Number of downloads: 145
Guitar_Piano_HoneTone2.mp3 ( 1.86MB ) Number of downloads: 163 |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Nov 8 2015, 08:38 PM |
Thanks Darius, here's the files you asked for, thank goodness for the ability to re-amp!! I removed all EQing and effects, just so we can focus on the amp tones to start. I think the rhythm already sounds a lot better.
Rhythm: RhythmHone1.wav ( 6.38MB ) Number of downloads: 179 Solo: SoloHone1.wav ( 26.14MB ) Number of downloads: 194 -------------------- |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Nov 9 2015, 08:08 PM |
Good evening sir..
Here are the takes with 1. The speaker icon moved to right :-) (nothing else changed) 2. The LPF from Reaper (with the speaker icon back to where it was for my take2 and no LPF from GR5) 3. The EQ from Reaper (with the speaker icon back to where it was for my take2 and no LPF from GR5) Thanks for all explanations ! JL
Attached image(s)
Attached File(s)
Guitar_Piano_HoneTone_SpeakRight.mp3 ( 1.86MB )
Number of downloads: 137
Guitar_Piano_HoneTone_LPFReaper.mp3 ( 1.86MB ) Number of downloads: 136 Guitar_Piano_HoneTone_EqReaper.mp3 ( 1.86MB ) Number of downloads: 139 |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Nov 10 2015, 02:46 AM |
Yes- I think your rhythm tone sound more even through all the frequency spectrum. I would go for a tiny roll off on bass know of that amp but I would verify this in a mix (you have to listen if it does not interfer too much with bass guitar in particular backing tracks/mixes. That tone sound good on a few different audio speakers and heaphones. It's not like "from under the blanket" while it does not hit with a lot of harsh treble. I will stick to it for now. Your solo tone has just a little bit of "fizzy" trble but I would liek to hear it in the mix since some of those might be a part of specific 5150 tone that you are trying to emulate there. It will not be easy to gey rid of those while not loosing whole clarity of your tone. That's a part of natural "american high gain" amps feature. I think this tone might work in the mix. You might only want to try to operato between a values like + or - 20 % on the middle and trble knobs - adding 20% of middle and cutting 20% of treble for example at the same time Again...I would like to hear both tones in the mix Ok, here's both the new tones in the original mix. WTII_Hone1.wav ( 40.31MB ) Number of downloads: 207 The 5150 was what I chose because I like it overall. If there's a better amp choice for getting a great lead tone I'd love to investigate it. We're kinda stripping it down to just the amp to begin with and I just wanted to get a chance to learn from you on develop tones for different scenarios. Thanks! -------------------- |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Nov 10 2015, 05:40 PM |
Good evening sir.. Here are the takes with 1. The speaker icon moved to right :-) (nothing else changed) 2. The LPF from Reaper (with the speaker icon back to where it was for my take2 and no LPF from GR5) 3. The EQ from Reaper (with the speaker icon back to where it was for my take2 and no LPF from GR5) Thanks for all explanations ! JL Well done! I would stick to the tone with microphone moved to the edge of the speaker I really like that tone. IT stays warm until you really want to show "the bite". Would you showed me on the screen of reaper os actually not a LPF. Low Pass should lok like right side of this picture (on the left you can see high pass filter) For this particular low gain tone you made for this lesson I will stick to the tone I've mentioned. But...when you'll add some gain for different type playing, you'll hear some treble coming out. That's why it is necessary for you to find exactly how to set-up low pass filtering in reaper. at the moment I think your tone could be considered as ready to use Ok, here's both the new tones in the original mix.
WTII_Hone1.wav ( 40.31MB )
Number of downloads: 207 The 5150 was what I chose because I like it overall. If there's a better amp choice for getting a great lead tone I'd love to investigate it. We're kinda stripping it down to just the amp to begin with and I just wanted to get a chance to learn from you on develop tones for different scenarios. Thanks! There is nothing wrong with your choice - just need to accept some specific features of particular amps Now when I listen to you tone in the mix I think I would go for that low cut (Hard to guess remotely but I think it would be around 20% of the knob scale) For the lead tone I would add around 1/4 of gain knob sacle od middle and keep the rest the way it is. Of course you can do whatever you like with reverb and delay - doesn't have to be that dry. Make sure you do not use to much compression or volume levels in your DAW. I think some of the compression I hear i cause buy a kind of limiter/compressor on a master track...or because a huge volume level of all tracks together. Is this a concious process done by you? |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Nov 10 2015, 07:44 PM |
Thanks a lot, merci beaucoup Darius !
JL |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Jan 18 2016, 09:53 PM |
Hello Darius,
Mertay suggested I post this here, (I think I've finally exhausted him ) When you get chance could you give me some advice on the tone please, no rush. I can also record using direct emulated xlr output from the amp if you want to hear that Using the SM57, Lead gain 4.75, eq 12'o'clock, Class A/b, master vol 2, HSH Strat, humbucker on Bridge, tone full up, vol around halfway. https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/assignment-1-take-5 Same amp/mic settings. Ibanez RG1570, neck pickup, guitar vol about half way. https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/assignment-1-take-6 Thank you This post has been edited by Phil66: Jan 18 2016, 11:05 PM -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Jan 20 2016, 10:00 PM |
Hello Darius,
Thank you for your input. For the moment, I'm trying to get a decent basic tone from amp only. I have done what you suggest and recorded two little pieces first played on the bridge then the neck. The first is from the MIC and the second, for reference was from the amp's direct XLR output which is supposed to be emulating a cab with the mic approx 200mm from the cab. https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/bridge-then-neck-darius-mic https://soundcloud.com/gmcphil-1/bridge-then-neck-darius-xlr Photobucket is down for maintenance at the moment. I'll post pics of mic placement ASAP. Thank you for your time Darius -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Jan 21 2016, 09:31 PM |
Mic pics.
Cheers Darius -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Jan 22 2016, 01:31 PM |
Thank you Darius,
I'll experiment over the coming days and repost a mic only track. I put the XLR direct from the amp purely for reference Cheers buddy -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
|
|
||
|
|
|
Jan 22 2016, 02:40 PM |
Great then! Awaiting your new samples If it's not a problem I would like to hear it in the mix as well.
|
|
|
||
|
|
|
Jan 22 2016, 10:02 PM |
Hello Darius,
I've just done an improvisation for the Guitar Loves Piano collab. HERE are the files with and without backing. I put the mic central and perpendicular to the grille. I stayed clean because I was trying to get my playing to get louder with the track by picking harder as the backing got louder. I was using an Ibanez RG1570 on the bridge pickup with the volume of the guitar about 3/4 up. I set EQ to Bass 7, Mid 6, treble 3, reverb 4, using full class A/B mode. The playing is not very good but this is a tone question so no need to comment about that Cheers Darius. -------------------- SEE MY GMC CERTIFICATE “Success is not obtained overnight. It comes in instalments; you get a little bit today, a little bit tomorrow until the whole package is given out. The day you procrastinate, you lose that day's success.” Israelmore Ayivor |
|
|
||